Looking for Crisco substitute for pie crust

[skanandron]

My husband loves blueberry pie, and I have a good source for wild blueberries. Blueberries, especially wild blueberries are very healthy. Real sugar isn't too bad, especially since we don't get a lot of sugar in our diet. I could certainly use less of it in the pie. My problem is the pie crust. The only shortening I know to use is Crisco. If I could find a better alternative, I'd be willing to make my husband blueberry pie more often.

Would coconut oil work? Would it make a difference if it's frefined or unrefined? What about a room temperature vegetable butter like mango butter?

Diane

 

[Andy M.]

A flaky pie crust depends on solid and firm fat. As you work the small bits of chilled fat (usually lard, butter, shortening or a combination) the bits of fat end up trapped in the flour and when the crust bakes, the fat melts and cause the flaky layers of crust to form.

I haven't seen a pie crust recipe using a liquid or soft fat.

 

[GLC]

What is the actual concern about shortening? If it's trans fats, know that Crisco reduced trans fats to near nothing in 2007. If the objection is to any room temperature-solid fat, the only alternative is to give up flaky pie crust. That's not so bad as it sounds. Shortening maker have preached flaky crusts for so long, and it's so traditional, that you would think anything else was inferior. And that gets into the realm of opinion. A crust made with liquid oil, which of course makes it impossible to get the pastry effect, can still be good, rather more like a soft cracker. But even "flaky" means different things to different people. Lots of folks consider their favorite oil pie crust to be flaky. There are many oil pie crust recipes on the Internet.

Or play with coconut oil. Coconut oil begins to solidify at room temperature and gets progressively harder as temperature drops, and if worked at the right temperature can have a similar effect to shortening.

Coconut Oil Pie Crust:

2 cups whole grain spelt flour
1 teaspoon salt
2/3 cup coconut oil (cold)
9 tablespoons cold water
Pie Filling:

Sift together flour and salt. Cut in coconut oil with a pastry blender until pieces are size of small peas. Sprinkle water, a tablespoon at a time, over part of mixture. Gently mix with fork; push to one side of bowl. Sprinkle next tablespoon water over dry part; mix lightly. Repeat until all is moistened.

Form into a ball and divide dough in half. Flatten slightly and roll on floured board. Repeat with other half.


Note: Some have reported significant spattering while baking when there were visible flakes of coconut oil in the dough. We're doing a pie crust, and while it is not mixed to uniformity like a batter, the ingredients are still well integrated to a course consistency. Shortening doesn't leave intact visible bits in the crust. Neither should the coconut oil be so cold it can't be integrated.

 

[CWS4322]

In a dark corner of my brain, I recall making a pie crust with oil when I didn't have any shortening in the house. It seems to me it was okay--not as good as my grandma's recipe or I probably would still make my piecrusts using oil. I seem to remember it had a different texture when rolling it (I rely on how the dough feels when making piecrust) and had more of a beige color. That's about all I remember--except that I did this while still living with my parents, so this was a century ago. I did a quick search on the Internet. It seems that all of the recipes that use vegetable oil also call for milk.

 

[bakechef]

Spectrum Organics makes a non-hydrogenated shortening, and that's what I use, it's a natural product and I've found that it works as a perfect substitute for just about anything calling for crisco. You can find it at Whole Foods, and I also can find it at Target.

You can also substitute all butter. This will make a very rich crust, and it will be less tender because of the water naturally occurring in butter, that shortening doesn't have.

Coconut oil, at least the ones that I've used, has a very low melting point, so it may not be a good substitute for a shortening type crust. An oil crust may be the way to go. An oil crust will never be flaky, but will be more crumbly, like a shortbread cookie.

 

[Robo410]

you can make a "pat in the pan" crust with softened shortening. You need to pre bake it 15 or so min before filling it. But that might work well with the coconut shortening. And then use a crumble top.

 

[skanandron]

There are a number of problems I have with Crisco. First, I don't use palm, soybean, canola or cottonseed oil. Crisco is made from soybean and palm oils. Second, I keep away from all hydrogenated oils except for coconut, which is naturally hydrogenated. Third, as an herbalist who makes soap, lotion, bath product etc., I've learned the value of unrefined oils and butters. Crisco is as refined as it gets. Finally, companies these days, with FDA approval, put a lot of effort in hiding information without looking like they're hiding it. If a serving contains less then half a gram of transfat, the label can say it contains 0 grams of transfat. One serving of Crisco is one tablespoon. How much do you use in a pie crust? I haven't made a pie in a long while, but if I remember right, six tablespoons? Worst case, you could be getting almost 3 grams of transfat per pie crust even though the label says Crisco is transfat free. I can't say how much transfat Crisco contains, however Crisco contains partially hydrogenated oil, and that means transfat.

I like the idea of using coconut oil. It's melting point is 76 degrees by the way. I would just have to keep it cooler then that. Maybe a cooler with ice packs from the freezer will do the trick, if the refrigerator makes it too cold?

What about other butters, like food grade cocoa, shea or mango? Anyone use non-traditional fats besides coconut?

 

[jennyema]

Frozen Butter

 

[Steve Kroll]

What about other butters, like food grade cocoa, shea or mango? Anyone use non-traditional fats besides coconut?

Just curious more than anything, but why are you looking at non-traditional fats? And are you committed to only using plant-based fats?

I'll admit I only occasionally make pie crusts, but I've found old-fashioned rendered leaf lard to be wonderful in pastry. Lard is a traditional product that was used for hundreds of years before being unjustly demonized in the 20th century, and it's never recovered its status. However, having used it for the last few years, I'm a convert. Not only does it produce flaky, well-flavored crusts, but lard has no trans-fats (provided you avoid the partially hydrogenated products on the market) and a healthier mix of fatty acids than, say, butter.

Of course, pie crust is one of those things that doesn't exactly scream "health food", no matter what kind of fat substitution you do.

 

[CWS4322]

Of course, pie crust is one of those things that doesn't exactly scream "health food", no matter what kind of fat substitution you do.

LOL.

 

[jabbur]

I have to admit, when I saw the title of this thread my first thought was "lard". My grandpa used to make the best pie crusts. I have his recipe and it calls for lard. When I make it using anything else, the crusts come out badly. With lard they are perfect every time. Lard is a natural fat and I'm sure you can find "organic" lard somewhere. However, if you're looking to avoid animal products it's not something to use.

 

[Oldvine]

Use extra cold butter, roll the crust extra thin. If there's an aversion to the fats providing the crisp to the crust, leave the crust on the plate making the crust serve only as the blueberry carrier.
Do a Google search for "Oil pie crust" and lots of versions will come up.

 

[Andy M.]

Consider other blueberry desserts.

 

[CWS4322]

This article might help you figure out which of the butters you eat might work.

Pastry case–Classic pie crusts without trans fat

 

[GLC]

I have to admit, when I saw the title of this thread my first thought was "lard". My grandpa used to make the best pie crusts. I have his recipe and it calls for lard. When I make it using anything else, the crusts come out badly. With lard they are perfect every time. Lard is a natural fat and I'm sure you can find "organic" lard somewhere. However, if you're looking to avoid animal products it's not something to use.

There's really no substitute for lard, nothing with quite the same taste and feel. People have come to shrink from pig fat, but natural lard has no trans fats and, according to the current understanding, which can and no doubt will change, it's "healthier" than butter. Some older memories will also be of beef tallow. Depends on where your people were. East Texans, for instance, used lard. West Texans used tallow. All in all, I'm pretty sure generations as late as those born around WWII ate a whole lot more lard (and butter and tallow and fabulous fried chicken) than we would ever think of eating. I do not note that they mostly died young.

I don't deliberately choose to prepare an inferior dish, solely on account of some ingredient being something you shouldn't gorge on. Biscuits is one. I don't make them often. But NOTHING works in them like lard. You're alive for a mere blip in eternity. The difference of maybe 1/8 blip that might be made by hitting upon just the right things to avoid (assuming not being hit by buses or falling off ladders and other things that end the game in sudden death) isn't, to me, worth eating lesser food than that which can just as easily be made.

I will say that the crust made with the different traditional fats are all different, and I sure won't turn down crust make with butter, common lard, leaf lard, tallow, or even shortening. And there may be subtle benefits from using one or another, depending on the pie filling. Duck fat is light in flavor. Leaf lard is meaty and, I think, makes the crust more a major player in the pie. Butter give some fillings a different note than lard. But at the top are leaf lard and the higher fat European style butters. Leaf lard is a little pricey. Something like $10 a pound if you buy four pounds or so. More like $20 in smaller units.

 

[skanandron]

Steve, I hear what you're saying about animal fats, but today's animal fat isn't the same as it was years ago. Animals are what they eat just as we are. It isn't the lard that's the problem. It the lard of a pig that has been fed a diet that it was not meant to eat, that is. The situation has become so bizarre it's almost funny. Almost. Go into any Whole Foods store and you'll see meat from an all vegetarian fed pig, chicken or cow. Well I appreciate that the animal wasn't fed meat from another pig, chicken or cow, but porcines aren't vegetarians. Neither are chickens. Cows are, but even cows won't produce healthy meat or fat on a corn diet. They're meant to eat grass.

If I could find lard from a pig that was fed the diet a pig was meant to eat, I would happily use it. Otherwise I'll stick to plant fats, and be picky about those. There are so many available that we never consider for cooking in this country. I'm curious about how well some of those would work.

 

[Steve Kroll]

Well I appreciate that the animal wasn't fed meat from another pig, chicken or cow, but porcines aren't vegetarians. Neither are chickens. Cows are, but even cows won't produce healthy meat or fat on a corn diet. They're meant to eat grass.

Yeah, I've done a lot of reading on this topic myself.

I could be totally off-base, but I believe that pigs in the wild are omnivores, just as we are. Specifically, they forage for their food. Roots, nuts, grains, and fruits comprise the bulk of their diet, but they will also readily consume grass, insects, and carrion, i.e. pretty much anything that registers to their senses as "food". But the majority of their food sources are plant-based. Domesticated pigs in the past were fed a variety of barnyard leftovers, including vegetable and animal matter (which probably wasn't the healthiest of foods, either).

Have you considered using tallow from grass-fed beef? It's not that hard to find. The CSA where I buy grass-fed beef has it available.

 

[skanandron]

Yes, pigs are omnivorous, and I would prefer the meat and lard from a pig that ate a very varied diet - including the insects, grubs, and carrion. The pig and it's meat and lard would be healthier.

I hadn't considered tallow. But if it will make a good pie crust, I'll see if I can find any from grass fed cows.

There have been several people on this thread who have suggested butter. I don't want to use butter alone, even though I use butter from grass fed cows. It seems too rich to me. But I do plan on using butter for 1/3 to 1/2 the fat.

There have been many replies to my question. Thank you every one. CWS4322, I haven't gone to the link you recommended yet, but I will.

 

[GotGarlic]

My mom told me the best cookies she ever made used chicken fat. I haven't tried it myself, but I might You could get a free-range chicken, roast it, then make stock, and skim the fat from the chilled stock. HTH.

 

[GLC]

If I could find lard from a pig that was fed the diet a pig was meant to eat, I would happily use it. Otherwise I'll stick to plant fats, and be picky about those. There are so many available that we never consider for cooking in this country. I'm curious about how well some of those would work.

Seems hard to find rendered lard from pastured hogs. It's pretty easy to find sources of pastured leaf lard, but rendering is up to you. More difficult still to find lard expressly from free range forest hogs feeding on acorns in season and what they can rustle otherwise. And mores still to find Iberico lard.

I see a farm in Rockdale, Texas that sells rendered pastured lard to pick up at a farmer's market in Austin. Might try that.