Mad Cook
Master Chef
My mother always recommended rinsing meat with vinegar if it was a bit suspect (not bad actually, just a bit ripe.)
Killing surface germs on meat
- Thread starter taxlady
- Start date
The friendliest place on the web for anyone that enjoys cooking.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
Mad Cook
Master Chef
Not for animals!
Mad Cook
Master Chef
The hounds at the hunt kennels ate both raw and canned food and that nasty dried kibble sort of food. They liked the raw best. The huntsman had a licence to humanely destroy fallen stock (injured cattle, sheep, horses, etc) and also to deal with the carcasses of farm animals which had died as a result of accidents. The hounds got the meat and looked very well on it.This is exactly why I am asking. I have gotten into arguments about this with two vets' nutritionists. They are convinced that I will put my cat at incredible risk if I feed him raw food. I am a little concerned because he is 18 y.o. I would like to have some scientific info to tell these nutritionists. The vets sell a book with cat food recipes. They are all cooked and contain vegis, fruit, and grain. Yes, cats get a bit of vegis, fruit, and grain in the digestive tracts of their prey, but it comes with the appropriate digestive enzymes. Those are enzymes that cats don't produce. The proportion of non-animal ingredients in the book's recipes is also a lot higher than what a cat would get in prey.
This subject came up again yesterday. Obviously the person was closed-minded on the subject. She insisted that taurine, as a supplement, is almost impossible to find. I told her that I had found it at Popeye's, a store that sells supplements for humans. Apparently weight lifters take it. She repeated how hard it is to find taurine.She also kept on about how horrible it is to see an animal with a bacterial infection. She doesn't believe that dipping the food in boiling water would kill the germs. I should have asked if she eats all her meat well done.
This vet uses a compromise between raw and cooked: Making Cat Food by Lisa A. Pierson, DVM :: homemade cat food, cat food recipes. She bakes chicken a bit. I tried that, but I have no idea how long to bake it. She used to dip in boiling water, but believes that one loses too many nutrients. But, she doesn't really cook for herself, so I don't think she has ever heard of making your own chicken stock, which I would add to the food instead of the water in the recipe. Yes, it would make the skin less digestible, but at least the cat would be getting mostly raw food.
He is not "The Dog Whisperer".
He is "The Dog Gourmand"
French Hounds Feeding at Chateau Cheverny - YouTube
He is "The Dog Gourmand"
French Hounds Feeding at Chateau Cheverny - YouTube
He is not "The Dog Whisperer".
He is "The Dog Gourmand"
I was amazed to see (in that video) that there weren't any real dog fights!
Personally, I don't like that way of feeding the dogs.
Maybe they had their reasons---- besides have the kennel floor licked clean by the dogs.
I was watching closely and a couple looked at each other sideways, but he was in complete control and the dogs knew not to start a squabble. I'm sure it would not be the same if he was not present.
I have to wonder though if every dog gets fed. My GSD is so submissive there's no way she would push her way into a pack like that for food. She would lag back and look for crumbs.
I imagine if they see one dropping weight they know who isn't getting any.
I have to wonder though if every dog gets fed. My GSD is so submissive there's no way she would push her way into a pack like that for food. She would lag back and look for crumbs.
I imagine if they see one dropping weight they know who isn't getting any.
I was watching fairly closely too----- since I was looking for fights.
You're right---- the more submissive dog won't get it's fair share. Losing weight as a barometer for whether it's getting it's fair share of food??? What happens then----- to the knackers?
Yeah, that guy with the big stick (or was that a stun stick?) standing by them? I've seen how some people 'train' their dogs.
OK, I may be getting a bit steamed up for something that isn't going to affect me personally. But........ Sigh.
Mad Cook
Master Chef
Unfortunately, if the young hounds show an inclination to fight during training they are (sorry to have to put it this way) culled as would be any adult hound which developed a taste for fighting.
I was amazed to see (in that video) that there weren't any real dog fights!
Personally, I don't like that way of feeding the dogs.
Maybe they had their reasons---- besides have the kennel floor licked clean by the dogs.
They are not pets and never can be. They must learn to be totally under the control of the Huntsman and Kennel Man or they are out and I don't mean they are sold or given away as pets!
OP
OP
Cool video Pac.
However, I still have no idea how long to parboil meat to kill surface contamination.
However, I still have no idea how long to parboil meat to kill surface contamination.
OP
OP
I don't mind the hijacking. It's interesting. I don't think of it as hijacking, but more as digression - like a flesh and blood conversation.I'm sure you're right, MadCook.
TaxLady said:
"However, I still have no idea how long to parboil meat to kill surface contamination."
I just hope to get some info about my question.
Last edited:
Popular opinion was that you don't need to worry about it. Perhaps this could best be answered in the context of being safe for humans.
Andy M.
Certified Pretend Chef
However, if you must do so, a quick immersion into boiling water will do the trick. Most food borne nasties are killed immediately at that temperature.
I like well-aged beef. The fanciest restaurants will serve well-aged beef, some of it dry-aged, for incredible prices.
When a steak or primal cut has been dry aged the butcher or chef will scrape off the 'scum' that forms with a sharp knife. I've seen that being done by a friend who used to be a chef and cooked the best rib roasts I've ever had, at home.
Done commercially it's done under carefully controlled conditions. My friend didn't but evidently his experience guided him.
When a steak or primal cut has been dry aged the butcher or chef will scrape off the 'scum' that forms with a sharp knife. I've seen that being done by a friend who used to be a chef and cooked the best rib roasts I've ever had, at home.
Done commercially it's done under carefully controlled conditions. My friend didn't but evidently his experience guided him.
OP
OP
Thanks Andy. Getting closer. That's pretty much what I figure, but I'm trying to find some documentation.
TaxL----- trying to find documentation. That's a good idea. I've been on many a health forum where claims are made but no scientific documentation given.
One forum, though, pretty much insisted on the source being given. Even though science papers say something and then later retract that later, you can trace the information back through all it's iterations. That's how science works.
Being frivolous here, guys---- but if Fox News or National Enquirer says it, then look for more proof. Emoticon entered here to show this was a frivolous statement.
One forum, though, pretty much insisted on the source being given. Even though science papers say something and then later retract that later, you can trace the information back through all it's iterations. That's how science works.
Being frivolous here, guys---- but if Fox News or National Enquirer says it, then look for more proof. Emoticon entered here to show this was a frivolous statement.
Taxi----- I had a few minutes and started thinking about your request (as per your original post). I'm a research nerd at heart and love nothing more than a science puzzle.
So----- just noodling around on the Internet gave me some questions. No answers just maybe some clarification.
First of all the word parboil isn't the word you want. It's more likely "blanching".
The temp. of boiling water (212 F) will kill most human pathogens. But you're asking about animal pathogens. They may be close enough for your questions though. Then the time for blanching/parboiling is another problem.
My few minutes is over now. But maybe someone else will read this and run with it. I may do more tomorrow.
(Just to be clear----- I personally wouldn't worry about it. But you are and it makes an interesting topic, scientifically.)
So----- just noodling around on the Internet gave me some questions. No answers just maybe some clarification.
First of all the word parboil isn't the word you want. It's more likely "blanching".
The temp. of boiling water (212 F) will kill most human pathogens. But you're asking about animal pathogens. They may be close enough for your questions though. Then the time for blanching/parboiling is another problem.
My few minutes is over now.
But maybe someone else will read this and run with it. I may do more tomorrow.(Just to be clear----- I personally wouldn't worry about it. But you are and it makes an interesting topic, scientifically.)
OP
OP
Almost all the Googling I did came up with tables/lists of what internal temps that meat needs to reach to be safe. A BBC article said that rare steak was safe, if not contaminated by utensils, because the germs are on the outside and searing kills them.Taxi----- I had a few minutes and started thinking about your request (as per your original post). I'm a research nerd at heart and love nothing more than a science puzzle.
So----- just noodling around on the Internet gave me some questions. No answers just maybe some clarification.
First of all the word parboil isn't the word you want. It's more likely "blanching".
The temp. of boiling water (212 F) will kill most human pathogens. But you're asking about animal pathogens. They may be close enough for your questions though. Then the time for blanching/parboiling is another problem.
My few minutes is over now.
(Just to be clear----- I personally wouldn't worry about it. But you are and it makes an interesting topic, scientifically.)
I eventually tried Googling "temperature to kill bacteria on utensils". I got similar results, but one page said 15 seconds at 165F to kill salmonella, but it was a cooking site and they didn't reference any scientific research.
Thanks for looking.
Last edited:
