Washing dishes with COLD water?

[pacanis]

That's the best advice yet! And if you accidentally fall in your sink and suck in a bunch of water - it'll be good for you too!

Multi-tasking dishwater. I love it.

Reading all this, which mostly makes sense, I now realize all the wasted effort of heating up the water on camping trips to wash the dishes in.

If I'm washing a pan or two I always rinse with hot water. It heats up the item and evaporates off quickly. Letting me put it away more quickly.

Farmers and chemicals. That's an interesting topic. I was pulling fallen branches out of my little feeder creek the other week and the thing reeked. It was running pretty good and with the recently melted snow and rains you would think the water would be "fresh". Not the case. It gets a lot of runoff from the vinyards up the road, but they haven't started spraying yet
When they do spray, across the road and directly upwind of me, the farmer wears one of those white tyvek (sp?) suits, goggles and particle mask. Here I am a hundred yards away with the white dust blowing right at me..... That has me a little concerned. I guess being farmers they don't have to wait for a windless day, but let me buy some Trimec from the local co-op and I get a lecture about spraying when the wind isn't blowing so the grape vines don't suffer any ill effects

But anyway.....

 

[GB]

I wash my dishes in cold water with just some washing up liquid added.
It is OK for at home but I would not like if a restaurant did it.

Mel

Why is it OK for home, but not for a restaurant?

 

[mozart]

Ever seen a river where this stuff runs off into? Filled with the foam... yick. Iquote]

Often this is caused by natural plant decomposition.

Lake Foam

 

[CeliacFamilyCook]

DW took the cap off an old bottle of TB cleaner and re-filled it, that is what I use now. Otherwise getting under the rim would drive me nuts as well! She did the same with the rest of her mixes keeping the spray bottles and labeling them with a black magic marker.

Good tip! Maybe I'll try that when I run out.

 

[mcnerd]

Ever seen a river where this stuff runs off into? Filled with the foam... yick. Iquote]

Often this is caused by natural plant decomposition.

Lake Foam

I always knew it as "Indian Soap". Gawd, maybe I'm showing my age.

 

[Wart]

Why is it OK for home, but not for a restaurant?

Because of the number of people your putting at risk.

 

[GB]

Because of the number of people your putting at risk.

That makes no sense. As has been stated earlier, the temp of the water does not play any role in killing the nasties. Washing in cold water gets your dishes just as clean as washing in hot so you are not putting any more people at risk.

 

[MexicoKaren]

Interesting discussion and probably no need for me to weigh in, but here goes. I did graduate work in public health about 30 years ago, and the word we got was that friction is the primary remover of bacteria, followed by soap, which does act as a surfactant...as everyone has said, if your dishwater were hot enough to kill germs, it would peel the skin off your hands. That said, I don't have a dishwasher either, and my dishes degrease and dry faster if I use hot water. Besides, it feels good.

 

[mozart]

Originally Posted by Mel!
I wash my dishes in cold water with just some washing up liquid added.
It is OK for at home but I would not like if a restaurant did it.

Mel
"Why is it OK for home, but not for a restaurant?"

Their may be some misunderstanding here. What Mel said is not OK in a restaurant. Regulations require either a commercial dishwasher that can raise temps high enough to sanitize must be used or the dishes must be hand sanitized in bleach after rinsing. The temperature of the water is irrelevant to sanitizing and as has been pointed out, higher temps in the sanitize sink will cause the chlorine to dissipate faster.

The issue is not putting more people at risk. The issue is there are more people potentially depositing pathogenic bacteria on dishes. This happens mainly when folks infected during colds, flu, strep throat and such. Also, and maybe even more important, restaurant workers are not known to be careful about getting dishes real clean. Sanitizing dishes will kill bacteria on even a dirty dish.

Whether it is OK at home, is a judgment call, in my opinion. I do find myself being more careful with many things when there is illness in the house. I think most will agree that it is harder to get dishes clean in cold water.

On the other hand, in SW Florida where I live, cold water comes out of the tap at 80 degree and has to be run a while just to get it down that low.

 

[Wart]

That makes no sense.

Neither does washing in cold water if hot is available.

People can do whatever they want at home.

That includes letting the dog lick'em clean. Why even bother with that? It's dry and not growing anything.

But if your working in a facility that feeds the 'masses' why run the risk of cleaning and leaving crud on an item?

Don't know about you but I wouldn't feel comfortable eating in an establishment that does not follow the minimums of time and temperature.

The higher the temperature of the wash water the less time and effort is needed to remove crud. And you really do want clean plates. ?

To further reduce risk tot he populace there are sanitation protocols. Long as the crud stuck to something is thin and porous enoufgh to allow the sanitizer to penetrate the crud then I guess not having cleaned stuff is OK.

Now if your just talking theory I guess washing in cold water is ok, long as there is a sanitizing detergent being used, or a proper sanitizing agent used post washing. But you know what they say about theory and practice.

 

[Wart]

Regulations require either a commercial dishwasher that can raise temps high enough to sanitize must be used or the dishes must be hand sanitized in bleach after rinsing. The temperature of the water is irrelevant to sanitizing and as has been pointed out,

According to my book, a minimum temp of 75 is required. Iodine and chlorines effectiveness drops off at temps lower than that.

Also the max temp is 120. Above that there are evaporation and compound forming issues.

Then theres, ah, what the heck, there are temp specs on just about everything.

 

[TATTRAT]

It all depends on if it is a chem. san dish machine OR a high temp san dish machine, where the final rinse is above 160.

Certain chemicals do not "activate" in low temp so it is also important to know what you are using.


Washing in cold water is ok, so long as it is going through a machine, or SOME sort of sanitizer.

 

[pacanis]

Wait a minute here......
What's to stop someone with clean, but unsanitized hands from unloading the restaurant's dishwasher?

 

[mozart]

Wait a minute here......
What's to stop someone with clean, but unsanitized hands from unloading the restaurant's dishwasher?

Nothing. But clean dishes won't allow bacteria to multiply. Low water activity and No food.

Best way to tell if a dry plate is clean is to sprinkle some fine sugar on it and then hold it vertically. If sugar remains, the plate isn't clean

 

[Maverick2272]

Nothing. But clean dishes won't allow bacteria to multiply. Low water activity and No food.

Best way to tell if a dry plate is clean is to sprinkle some fine sugar on it and then hold it vertically. If sugar remains, the plate isn't clean

Nice tip, I will have to remember that one!

 

[Maverick2272]

Ever seen a river where this stuff runs off into? Filled with the foam... yick. Iquote]

Often this is caused by natural plant decomposition.

Lake Foam

Both are true. Some is natural, some is not. Bottom of the first page it talks about foam from phosphorus, and that yes it is harmful:
http://www.in.gov/idem/programs/water/quality/surveys/025surfacefoam.pdf
It is in .PDF format so you need Adobe Acrobat to read it.
Once or twice a year, growing up, we would get the harmless foam, and sometimes we would even play around in it.
The other 8 times it showed up in our river, it was from huge amounts of phosphorus in the river. It was our sign not to play in the river anymore. Also within a couple of years of this happening on a regular basis, they put up signs warning us to no longer fish the river either, not that there were that many fish left.. the stink from them rotting was enough to discourage both activities anyway.

 

[mozart]

Nice tip, I will have to remember that one!

I suggest you don't try that at home with DW's washed dishes. It is a no win situation. Either she will be mad because you exposed her dishes as dirty or she will be mad because you spilled sugar all over the floor

 

[Maverick2272]

I suggest you don't try that at home with DW's washed dishes. It is a no win situation. Either she will be mad because you exposed her dishes as dirty or she will be mad because you spilled sugar all over the floor

Or, she might end up mad at me because they are dirty and I spilled the sugar!

 

[Andy M.]

Or, she might end up mad at me because they are dirty and I spilled the sugar!

Only if she washed the dishes.

If you washed them she's going to tell you to wash them over and to wash the kitchen floor while you're at it.

 

[Jeff G.]

Actually many doctors(and myself) feel we use WAY to many anti-bacterial substances. Our bodies lose the ability to create their on anti-bodies. If you body is never exposed to a bacteria, the first time it is, it won't be able to fight it off.

Jeff

The only reason we use hot water to wash dishes is because I just cant bring myself to stick my hands in cold water. But, we don't go out of our way to heat it up either, I know it will never get hot enough to sanitize and even if it did I wouldn't want to stick my hand into that either! We get it just hot enough to be comfortable, so maybe a nice warm water would be a better description there.
We don't use anti bacterial anything. The dish soap we do use has grease cutters in it, and DW has been known to add vinegar as well. I thought at first, "man, rinse those dishes cause I don't want any vinegar taste or smell left over!'. But that never happened so I don't bother her.
She even makes a lot of our household cleaners herself, saves money! People tell us we are not being safe because we don't buy fancy anti-bacterial washes and soaps and hand sanitizers all the time. But then when you ask them, they use tons of the stuff and yet their kids have all these allergies and illnesses the parents don't while my kids are healthy on every Dr. checkup. Our Dr. even remarked that the only time she has seen my 10 year old daughter in the last 8 years that she has been their Dr. is for her regular checkups and school physicals (well that and a couple of minor injuries).
I really think there is something in this theory that using all these things is putting us in danger and would love to see a long term study on the subject. Then again I would love it if they took the 'foaming' agents out of the soaps as well, they serve no purpose other than to give us visual 'proof' that the soap is there and working.
Ever seen a river where this stuff runs off into? Filled with the foam... yick. I also worry about the effect of all these chemicals on the environment. I remember growing up we had to start treating our well water because it had become undrinkable due to the enormous amount of chemicals the farmers where pumping into the soil and onto the crops. And yet, no laws passed to reduce this despite the fact that all ground water out there now has to be treated to be drinkable. Smokers even had a standing joke that water would get them long before the smoking did.
They were probably wrong, but still...