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Old 05-10-2005, 02:58 PM   #11
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ok, so have we decided? was it the chicken or the egg?
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Old 05-11-2005, 02:03 AM   #12
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I don't like chicken tikka masala but I love Chicken Tikka as a dry dish with nan and yoghurt mint sauce, yum.

Scott I do think Ishbel is right. The Pakistanis/Indians have been making tomato based sauces for centuries, however the masala sauce is cream and tomato based, and the westernised CTM initially contained a tin of Campbells soup rather than authentic tomatoes. It was an example of fusion cooking, before the term was even thought of. There are plenty of examples of tomato based chicken curries, but they are not chicken tikka masala. The difference is an Indian mother in the Punjab would use fresh, raw chicken. They would not use the pre cooked marinated spiced chicken (which is essentially what CTM is)

Indians would be quite insulted to think that it originated from their home country. It was created in this country by expat Indians/Pakistanis (bear in mind most of them had emigrated before division so Pakistan would not have actually existed), in an attempt to soften the British palate so that they could introduce further curry experiences to the Brits, and I must say, it has been very successful. One only has to drive along the streets of Rusholme in Manchester to see the number of Westerners enjoying the "asbestos underpants" variety of curries, rather than the watered down nursey food versions.

Ishbel will no doubt like the story that Chicken Tikka Masala was created in Glasgow in the 1950's, but I go for the Birmingham creation legend!!!!!
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Old 05-11-2005, 03:15 AM   #13
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Hehheeee - Kyles! I'd never heard that Glasgow claimed the 'honour' of the dish.... I always thought it was Brum! Certainly the popularity of balti houses in the UK is down to Birmingham.
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Old 05-11-2005, 05:39 AM   #14
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LOL Glad you saw reason Ishbel!!! I still don't really understand curry houses, not quite my cup of tea, I much prefer a Thai curry, I find the Brit-Indian curries a bit too full on and not enough veg for my liking, but I am getting used to them. My hubby is a huge curry fan. I stick to my chicken tikka and nan for the most part!
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Old 05-11-2005, 05:45 AM   #15
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I like Thai food - but prefer Indian. I suppose it's all to do with what you grew up with - and, in comparison to Indian cuisine in the UK, Thai and Vietnamese are Johnny come lately Asian cuisines

I like really hot curries. My sister always makes a curry house her first meal 'out' when she comes home from Aus. She really pines for a good Indian curry! That's one thing that I never found in Australia - a good Indian curry house - and my sister has probably tried every one in Sydney, Melbourne and Adelaide.... We tried a posh one on Darling Harbour - a kind of fusion, pacific rim meets Indian cuisine type of place - very, very SWISH... but the food was not good at all.
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Old 05-11-2005, 08:11 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyles
There are plenty of examples of tomato based chicken curries, but they are not chicken tikka masala. The difference is an Indian mother in the Punjab would use fresh, raw chicken. They would not use the pre cooked marinated spiced chicken (which is essentially what CTM is)
Not all Punjab/NW Indian families have tandoors, but many do and all the restaurants do. For a restaurant or a family with a tandoor, the chicken is marinated and then roasted either whole or in parts and then added to the gravy. This has been going on for as long as their have been tandoors - a very long time. The only difference with tikka is that it's deboned before roasting.

Dry cooked chicken added to gravy has been occuring in NW India for hundreds of years.
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Old 05-11-2005, 08:44 AM   #17
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Uh, just about all Indian chicken is cooked DRY. Tikka just happens to be boneless/chunks rather than parts or whole. It's all done in the tandoor. Are you telling me that although you agree with me that tomato based gravies can be found with tandoori chicken, your contention is that no one in India ever removed the bone before adding to the tomato gravy? That no one sliced the chicken before combining the two? You act like tikka is some special dish. It's just boneless tandoori chicken. That's it.



I am extremely real. I've spoken to tens of Indian/Indian chefs about this (specifically NW Indians) and the legend is offensive to them. How would you feel if your culture produced one of the best cuisines on the planet, but in order to make it 'better' some ignorant foreigner had to demand that the dish be served with gravy? It's a tremendous insult.

I love the internet, but it has it's flaws. One of those flaws is that misinformation can get repeated thousands of times, and, in the process, appear to be fact. The misinformation has an even greater tendency to be spread if it's charming, quaint and plausible. This myth is all three. No matter how you add it up, though, charming, quaint and plausible do not translate into true.
I'm not going to try to tell you ANYTHING - you obviously know so much more than me, here in my little racist bubble....
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Old 05-12-2005, 10:34 AM   #18
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Moved to appropriate forum.
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