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Old 09-03-2006, 07:44 AM   #1
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What is the difference between pizza and basic bread doughs?

Are the doughs for Italian, and French different from regular bread as well?

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Old 09-06-2006, 02:25 AM   #2
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Probably, I think that pizza dough is a little richer then some types of bread, whenever I make mine I make it with bread flour, salt, olive oil, sugar, and yeast.

But then once I made a chinese themed pizza with dough that was for steamed buns (mantou). And that still turned out well, so I don't really think it matters THAT much. Although authenticity is important.
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Old 09-07-2006, 04:31 PM   #3
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I've noticed that it depends on which type of pizza you are making.

Yeast doughs for pizza tend to be more breadlike, but more bland, with less salt and sugar in the dough. This allows the topping flavors to shine.

Crispy-crust pizzas can be made either with baking soda/powder, or yeast. But they are not allowed to rise to a thick crust. They are also worked very thin.

Pre-made pizza doughs available either raw, or as a mix, that are found on supermarket store shelves are more like a biscuit dough and use baking powder as the leavening agent.

Pre-made pizza doughs that are already cooked, but with no toppings are usually yeast risen flat breads, like a focacia bread.

So your question about what a pizza dough is, is difficult to answer as it differs from one person to the next.

Myself, I prefer a soft, thick yeast-risen crust with a good buttery/yeasty flavor. And I found out by talking to people who know how to make pizza, that pizza's are cooked at very hot temperatures from between 450 to 600 degrees. I like to cook mine at 550.

For a good, thick crust, soft pizza, the dough has to rise once, be formed on the pizza pan, and then allowed to rise a second time to develop its height. Then it is cooked until the crust is not quite browning yet but will hold its shape. That allows me to put good toppings on without the thing collapsing.

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Old 09-08-2006, 07:26 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ardor
Are the doughs for Italian, and French different from regular bread as well?
One person's "regular" bread is another's speciality bread.

I think in the US, most people would say"regular" bread is white or whole wheat bread baked in a loaf pan. These are distinguished from "artisan" breads, which are shaped freeform and baked on a flat surface.

Breads baked in a loaf pan are typically made from a firmer dough (less water content) than artisan breads and are baked longer at a lower temperature (typically 350-375F for 45 to 60 minutes, depending on size). The recipe will typically contain some fat (oil/ butter) and sweetener (sugar/honey). For white loaf bread, it is not uncommon to use milk (heated and cooled) for all or some of the liquid in the recipe.

The classic french baguette or italian long loaf typically is made only from flour, water, salt and yeast - no sweetener or fat. The dough contains a higher proportion of water than a loaf-style bread and, of course, it is baked on a flat surface (baking stone) at a high temperature (500-550F) for a shorter amount of time (15-20 min). These breads also use preferments. A preferment is a dough made with water, flour and a small amount of yeast which is then allowed to rise a long time (8 to 24 hours). The preferment is then used as an ingredient in the final recipe. Since the preferment contains active yeast cells, the final recipe typically uses less yeast than an American-style loaf bread. The interior of the bread has a more "open" structure (e.g. - holes!). Due to both the elongated shape of the loaf and the baking techniques, the surface is crusty. Since these breads contain no oil, they stale quickly.

Pizza dough (the kind used for thin-crust pizza) is closer to the techniques for artisan bread than loaf bread. Unlike the classic french or italian loaf, pizza dough typically contains some olive oil. Pizza dough recipes usually do not call for a preferment. Also, the rising time is shorter, so they may contain more yeast to start with.
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Old 09-08-2006, 07:49 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chausiubao
But then once I made a chinese themed pizza with dough that was for steamed buns (mantou). And that still turned out well, so I don't really think it matters THAT much. Although authenticity is important.
Sorry to go slightly O/T here, but are these what I would call Barbeque Pork Buns? Or Chinese Custard or lotus paste buns? A light steamed white dough? Eaten steaming hot surrounding a filling?

If so do you have a recipe you can post in a more appropriate thread for me (again soory for O/T). BBQ Pork buns are about my favourite things in the world, and my husband LOVES chinese custard buns. I would love to be able to make them at home. I have bought them frozen at Chinese Supermarkets, but making them would be really fun.
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Old 09-08-2006, 05:05 PM   #6
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Mantou is a steamed bun. Some people make them with yeast dough, and some people make them with baking powder.

What you're taking about is when we take mantou dough, fry some minced barbecue pork, sugar, hoisin sauce (no idea what this is in english), soy sauce, and green onions (some also use rice wine), then stuff the mixture inside the dough. Well its more like a folding technique, but you get the idea.

This is the recipe I've been using for steamed buns.

3 C. Bread Flour
1 C. Water
1 1/2 Tsp. Active Dry Yeast
3 Tbsp. Sugar

Dissolve the sugar in the water, and proof the ADY in the water. Then mix this with the flour (slowly, as you add more in) There will probably be too much flour to water, but thats why you add it in slowly. Knead and when the dough is nice and smooth and elastic, oil it, cover in plastic wrap and let it rise for two hours.

For the shaping, roll it into a long sausage, and flatten out the ends. Then cut that into 12 different pieces.

While all this is happening you'll want to take a large steamer, and use it to boil some water.

If you want you can put wax paper on the bottom of the buns to keep them from sticking to the steamer (this works wonders, though putting lots of lettuce on the bottom of the steaming racks works too)

When steam is coming out of the closed steamer, put in the buns, they'll probably steam for about 20+ minutes. You should check them after fifteen minutes, if u poke them with chopsticks they should bounce back, but I always let the larger ones (like these) go for 20 minutes, then tear them open to make sure.

I can give u a recipe for "barbecue pork buns" too if you like.
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Old 09-10-2006, 07:06 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chausiubao
I can give u a recipe for "barbecue pork buns" too if you like.
You mean Chausiubao? Please do! =P

I'm not sure that mantous and baos use the same kind of dough though... Mantous always seem sweeter to me.
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