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Old 08-17-2007, 08:46 AM   #11
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BD, you're right. He was a top ballplayer before the drugs. He would have made the Hall of Fame without them, just not as a home run hitter.
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Old 08-17-2007, 09:04 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by ironchef
Personally, I don't really care as to whether or not Barry took 'roids. Without them, he would still have easily been a first ballot Hall of Famer. Along with Ken Griffey Jr., Bonds was one of the top two best outfielders and one of the top five best players in the 90's, a true five-tool talent who could do it all. He was a great player way before he hit the 73 homeruns.

However, his surly attitude distanced himself from most fans, and how he handled the whole Balco fiasco was very poor. How he handled the other allegations and the ensuing scandal was just as bad. For me, that's the problem that I have with his character.
The problem is he just broke the most coveted record in baseball. It isn't about his HOF status.

Baseball is a games of stats and records.
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Old 08-17-2007, 09:10 AM   #13
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The only reason the name 'Barry Bonds' is known in every household, is the fact that he surpassed Hank Aaron. I'm definately not making excuses for anyone, but PED's have been in MLB for a long time. The former Mets clubhouse manager has a laundry list of active players that were once users. I think it was 175 ballplayers?

Bonds has his time in the spotlight now, but I'm sure he will be surpassed in the near future. (gulp....A-Rod)
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Old 08-17-2007, 04:12 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by IainDaniel
The problem is he just broke the most coveted record in baseball. It isn't about his HOF status.

Baseball is a games of stats and records.
HOF status is actually a part of it. For example, many people close to baseball don't feel that Rafael Palmeiro deserves to be in the Hall of Fame despite his 569 homeruns. If Palmeiro doesn't get voted in, then who does and who doesn't? Sosa? McGwire? Bonds? By all accounts, Bonds' last juice-free season (except for maybe recently) was in 2000. Out of all the notable players who have made the 500 homerun club (a usual sign of surefire HOF status) and have been linked to steriod use, Bonds is arguably the only one who would have made the HOF without the stats put up in his juiced years.
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Old 08-19-2007, 03:21 PM   #15
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My 2 cents. Schilling vs. Bonds = big mouth vs. big mouth.
It will amount to nothing. Its hear say and won't hold up in court, this is how big boys fight I suppose.

As for HOF, Palmero was one of those soft spoken guys that never craved the spotlight, had he not done the Viagra commercials people would forget about him completely. Yes he deserves HOF, and will make it....50 years from now from a Vets committee vote. Its just what happens to the soft spoken.

Bonds is a GREAT player, before the juice he was one of maybe 1-3 guys, perhaps the first, to have a 40 HR 40 SB year. He is a disagreeable man, however. He did break the Babes and Aarons records, so if you give the average man steroids, they wouldnt come close to that, but the juice helped.

Where I stand? If Pete Rose isnt in for how "he defamed the game" Bonds should get the same treatment x10!! But....I think they both should be allowed in. They were well above great players and well below average men.
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Old 08-19-2007, 03:57 PM   #16
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perhaps the first, to have a 40 HR 40 SB year. He is a disagreeable man, however.
Actually, the first 40/40 player was the Granddaddy of the juicers: Jose Canseco
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Old 08-21-2007, 10:32 AM   #17
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HOF status is actually a part of it. For example, many people close to baseball don't feel that Rafael Palmeiro deserves to be in the Hall of Fame despite his 569 homeruns. If Palmeiro doesn't get voted in, then who does and who doesn't? Sosa? McGwire? Bonds? By all accounts, Bonds' last juice-free season (except for maybe recently) was in 2000. Out of all the notable players who have made the 500 homerun club (a usual sign of surefire HOF status) and have been linked to steriod use, Bonds is arguably the only one who would have made the HOF without the stats put up in his juiced years.
I don't really see it that way. I have no problem with him being in the HOF, baseball made the bed they play in, and neglected the problem.

Cheating and baseball have gone on since the beginning of the game. From Corked Bats (even mentions of Ruth using one) to Gaylord Perry(current HOF'er) scuffing balls, and using the spitball, to George Brett and the infamous pinetar incident.

Is it right NO. But society for the most part doesn't really give two craps.
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Old 08-23-2007, 11:44 AM   #18
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This should be interesting:

FOX Sports on MSN - MLB - Report: Ex-Mets attendant named clients
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