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Old 02-22-2007, 12:21 PM   #41
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If chivalry means all of us being polite and thoughtful, I'm all for it. If chivalry means that men should treat women as if they're somehow more fragile or might topple off that proverbial pedestal, then I pass.

So yes, I am a feminist. A feminist is a person, man or woman, who believes in equal rights for women, pure and simple. The word may at times be applied to those who have twisted that simple definition to such an extent that is unrecognizable, a not uncommon phenomenon in any "radical" social movement, but that's what feminism means.

For those of you who dismiss it casually, please remember It wasn't until 1920 that American women could even vote in federal elections, thanks to the Nineteenth Amendment and that it's really only in the last several decades that women have been able to enjoy the same advantages as men and have begun to be respected as equals. Now, women have the CHOICE, if economically feasible, to stay home with their children or the CHOICE to have a career.

We may have come a long way (baby), but I am constantly reminded by news events and by often subtle anecdotal evidence that we shouldn't become complacent. So I'm less interested in someone opening a literal door for me solely because I'm a female than I am in society continuing to open the door of opportunity for women in general.
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Old 02-22-2007, 01:13 PM   #42
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I think that being in a relationship and treating your significant other very well shows that they are special to you. I ALWAYS open my significant other's car door but if I'm driving to lunch with female co-workers I expect them to be able to manage that function. In public, I ALWAYS open the doors of buildings and such for my significant other and allow her to enter first... while I hold the door for strangers (male or female) if it is convenient and appropriate to do so.

I am far more likely to stop and assist a female driver who has broken down along the road. Is this because I assume they are less capable of getting back on their way without assistance? Yes, probably. But I think that, as a rule, women ARE less capable and practiced at such things. I acknowledge that many are capable and that some men are less capable than others, but that's just the way things are. By the same token, I would hope that a woman would be inclined to step up and help me if I were in a situation that they would probably know more about than me.

I believe in complete equality under the law, but I acknowledge that there are both physical and cultural reasons why we are different.
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Old 02-22-2007, 01:38 PM   #43
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I believe in complete equality under the law, but I acknowledge that there are both physical and cultural reasons why we are different.

Absolutely. Anyone who disputes that men and women are different both by nature and nurture is ignoring reality.

But at times in our past, special treatment of women was part and parcel of a point of view that did not exactly promote a view of equality under the law. "Protecting" women often equaled disenfranchisement.

And in an interesting backlash against women's rights, there are those who blame not just the death of chivalry but the almost every one of our social ills on the dreaded "feminists." I see that as a understandable, if simplistic and unnuanced, nostalgia for what seemed like a simpler time, when men and women had more discrete roles. I can't tell you how many times I've heard people, men and women alike, bemoan the complexity of a world without the old road map.
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Old 02-22-2007, 01:49 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clutch
...
Yes, Chilvary is dead and it was killed by women.....
Exactly. I am one of those men who likes to hold door open for a woman, and who wouldn't let a woman lift a havy box, and pool the chair in the restaraunt etc. But a while ago I held the door, or rather tried to hold the door for one of the ladies, well I shouldn't call her a lady, the word that comes to mind is not permited to use here. So she yeld and scramed at me and called me names, like sissy etc. Like after that anyone would like to hold a door, yeah right.
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Old 02-22-2007, 03:11 PM   #45
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I think it has got alot to do with how you were raised and your role models, both my sons and grandson have been taught and have seen how to treat others. Iam proud of them !
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Old 02-22-2007, 03:15 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CharlieD
Exactly. I am one of those men who likes to hold door open for a woman, and who wouldn't let a woman lift a havy box, and pool the chair in the restaraunt etc. But a while ago I held the door, or rather tried to hold the door for one of the ladies, well I shouldn't call her a lady, the word that comes to mind is not permited to use here. So she yeld and scramed at me and called me names, like sissy etc. Like after that anyone would like to hold a door, yeah right.
That reflects not on you Charlie, but on her. That is an unfortunate experience, but simply reflects on her lack of class and manners not on yours.
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Old 02-23-2007, 12:11 AM   #47
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As long as "The Dark Knight" Breathes, there will always continue to be Chilvary our fair maidens. You will have to ask Barbara who it is sometime. Long Live "The Dark Knight" !
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Old 02-23-2007, 05:19 AM   #48
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Americans are much criticized these days, mostly for political reasons, but they are a very polite people in general, whatever you may think.

Best regards,
Alex R.
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