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Old 05-24-2008, 07:47 PM   #91
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i think so too, I am actually planning on spending some time on Apple's website for awhile once I feel better. The computer I was planning on replacing was DW's, giving her my HP and getting a new one for me, but now.... ?? Maybe she would be happier on a MAC. It can do everything she needs to do, and the fact that no one targets MACs is a plus for her online business dealings.
I do know this, if MS keeps messing up with their OS, MAC is going to continue getting more and more popular.
Not that I have anything against that...
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Old 05-24-2008, 07:51 PM   #92
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This has been a helpful discussion for me - objective and factual for the most part, without the posturing and egotism that often comes up when people debate Macs vs. PCs. Thanks alot to everyone who made a contribution. Given the apparently deteriorating situation with Windows, I'm pretty sure that my next computer will also be a Mac.
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Old 05-24-2008, 09:42 PM   #93
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This has been a helpful discussion for me - objective and factual for the most part, without the posturing and egotism that often comes up when people debate Macs vs. PCs.
You mean comments like people who own Macs own Macs because they have to? L

At one time that was a truth, not so much anymore. Back then I had batch files and config.sys memorized. To this day I have yet to learn how to manually manipulate the registry.

The only times I have had problems with Windows was when using homeowner OSs, 95 and Me. 95 was so bad I went to NT4. Then we got a new Dell with Me which didn't last long before I installed Win 2k Pro and used it for almost 8 years. And we got this machine with Vista Home Edition, it lasted maybe a week before I loaded XP Pro. 2~3 reboots a day with 95 was not uncommon. With Win2k and XP Pro it's not uncommon for the machine to be left running/ not be rebooted between Tuesdays (when I cycle into Admin to check for updates) or when I load software.

But, yeah, I really haven't had problems with the Pro/ Business/ Commercial OSs.

The reason I purged Vista wasn't because it crashed or ate data, it was because after NT4 and Win2K Vista was just too inhibiting. Only odd thing with XP vs 2K was the forced creation of a second admin account.

I remember updating drivers a decade ago .... someplace between a nightmare and headache. Today I just go to the Dell site and check versions. If there is a newer version for this machine I effectively download, run and that's it. I believe Dell provides a utility to do this for me but what's the fun in that?

Something that may be important here is I DO NOT use OEM OSes. I had a really bad experience in 2000 with HP and their proprietary cra ... stuff, That machine was not here long.

I think many problems with Vista and PCs is the preinstalled OEM version of the OS.
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Old 05-24-2008, 09:49 PM   #94
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That is true, for my OS's I buy the full versions so I can get rid of the OEM junk. Maybe part of the reason I have less problems than most people it seems.
On another note, I was cruising the DELL site looking at the XPS systems, and noticed that 2 out of the 4 models offered came preloaded with XP Pro, not Vista.
So it would be quite easy to order a new DELL computer pre-loaded with XP Pro and not have to pay extra for it.
Don't worry Andy, not switching my opinion, LOL.
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Old 05-24-2008, 10:27 PM   #95
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Maverick and Wart:

IMO, it's wrong that you have to go through all that 'stuff' to have a computer that works right.

Hmnmm, let's see....

I bought a Toyota Prius but didn't like how the hybred system worked so I yanked it out and replaced it with a Corolla gas engine. I haven't had a single problem since!
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Old 05-25-2008, 12:44 AM   #96
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Maverick and Wart:

IMO, it's wrong that you have to go through all that 'stuff' to have a computer that works right.
Go through all what?

Quote:
Hmnmm, let's see....

I bought a Toyota Prius but didn't like how the hybred system worked so I yanked it out and replaced it with a Corolla gas engine. I haven't had a single problem since!
LOL, really.
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Old 05-25-2008, 01:11 AM   #97
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On another note, I was cruising the DELL site looking at the XPS systems, and noticed that 2 out of the 4 models offered came preloaded with XP Pro, not Vista.
We have an Inspiration. When we ordered it in November it was offered with only Vista.

OTOH

At the same time some XPS systems had options of Vista, XP and I believe a flavor of Linux.
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Old 05-25-2008, 10:01 AM   #98
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Originally Posted by Wart View Post
Go through all what?...

Go through all this:

Following are extracts from a number of earlier posts in this thread. All of them refer to issues that have to be dealt with using expertise the majority of computer users do not posess.


“That is true, for my OS's I buy the full versions so I can get rid of the OEM junk”

“The only times I have had problems with Windows was when using homeowner OSs, 95 and Me. 95 was so bad I went to NT4.”


“The reason I purged Vista wasn't because it crashed or ate data, it was because after NT4 and Win2K Vista was just too inhibiting. Only odd thing with XP vs 2K was the forced creation of a second admin account.”

“Something that may be important here is I DO NOT use OEM OSes. I had a really bad experience in 2000 with HP and their proprietary cra ... stuff, That machine was not here long.

Myself I am taking the kids two DELL Inspirons and removing Vista in favor of Media Center Edition.”

“I totally agree. Since i deal with this all day at work ( IT administration) and i use Linux and windows all day at school, If i were you i would stay with XP professional especially since Service Pack 3 just came out for XP. Microsoft will stop supporting XP as of this June. ANy one with XP, i would update it with all the newest windows updates.

Now to the real stuff. I use vista alot but i would NOT use it in a business environment just yet. Wait tell next year or wait until you have to. Vista is not the best at networking. I try it at work with my laptop all the time and 60% of the time, it cant find my server even when i put in the path for it.
Since networking is my specialty, vista is a hinderence to me right now. I use win 2k and Linux.”

“When we ordered this new machine Dell it was offered only with Vista so I also ordered XP Pro from a third party vendor. Glad I did. It didn't take long to get tired of being asked if I wanted to do what I was trying to get it to do.

The last straw was when I was trying to burn graphics files to DVD and Vista wouldn't let me. ? So I logged in as Administrator and ... Vista wouldn't let me move them. Might have something to do with the machine running in two Vista accounts simultaneously.”

“I do IT support, so I know a thing or two about computers, and even more about how impossible a task it would be to idiot-proof Windows (no offense to anyone). As an IT Pro. I deal with Windows issues daily, so solving and/or preventing Windows issues is not an problem for me in the slightest. However, at home I've been a Mac user since the rollout of OS X. I love that it is simple, that it is incredibly intuitive, and isn't really plagued by problems the way Windows is, either in type, volume, or severity. It's just easy to use, and while I know how to tell my computer what to do, be it Mac or PC, I'll always prefer to use the one that does it simpler.”


Holy Crap! Who wants to deal with all that!?


P.S. I didn't take the time to go through all the posts. This should be enough to make my point.
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Old 05-25-2008, 01:02 PM   #99
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We have an Inspiration. When we ordered it in November it was offered with only Vista.

OTOH

At the same time some XPS systems had options of Vista, XP and I believe a flavor of Linux.
They must have changed something since then, now if you go to their web site you still have a choice of several operating systems. Of course, they recommend the most expensive one...
I ordered two Inspirons for the kids, I chose Vista because I figured if I was going to talk about it, I should play with it for awhile.
My first impression was: Cool new interface and look, very very slow OS, extremely overburdened because Microsoft is busy trying to make it do everything thus eliminating third party software plus playing 'cop' for the music and movie industry.

What everyone needs to remember is that there is no law saying you have to buy Microsoft's newest OS just because they offer it. And the reason I buy my OS separate is because then I own it, I can put it on any machine I choose, no matter how new the machine. Most of the time this is not because I don't necessarily dislike their newer OS, but because I like the OS I have and am comfortable with it and after all this time have it just where I want it in terms of configuration.
The reason I get rid of OEM stuff is not because the OS is bad, but because of all the junk the manufacturer puts on there. All that third party software, IMHO, gunks up the works and causes nothing but problems. If the manufacturer would not add onto the OS or put all that extra junk on there, then the OEM OS would be the best OS out there for PCs as, like the MAC, it is tuned to the computer.

I will not argue with Andy's Prius point. He is right, Microsoft should be spending more time debugging before releasing new OS's into the market. Most software companies do extensive debugging, then farm it out to paid debuggers in the 'field' so to speak, then go to beta, then release. Maybe this is why they don't have nearly as many problems as Microsoft does.

While I love my PC's and their 'toys', I have no love for Microsoft...
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Old 05-30-2008, 10:46 PM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy M. View Post
Go through all this:

Following are extracts from a number of earlier posts in this thread. All of them refer to issues that have to be dealt with using expertise the majority of computer users do not posess.


“That is true, for my OS's I buy the full versions so I can get rid of the OEM junk”

“The only times I have had problems with Windows was when using homeowner OSs, 95 and Me. 95 was so bad I went to NT4.”


“The reason I purged Vista wasn't because it crashed or ate data, it was because after NT4 and Win2K Vista was just too inhibiting. Only odd thing with XP vs 2K was the forced creation of a second admin account.”

“Something that may be important here is I DO NOT use OEM OSes. I had a really bad experience in 2000 with HP and their proprietary cra ... stuff, That machine was not here long.

Myself I am taking the kids two DELL Inspirons and removing Vista in favor of Media Center Edition.”

“I totally agree. Since i deal with this all day at work ( IT administration) and i use Linux and windows all day at school, If i were you i would stay with XP professional especially since Service Pack 3 just came out for XP. Microsoft will stop supporting XP as of this June. ANy one with XP, i would update it with all the newest windows updates.

Now to the real stuff. I use vista alot but i would NOT use it in a business environment just yet. Wait tell next year or wait until you have to. Vista is not the best at networking. I try it at work with my laptop all the time and 60% of the time, it cant find my server even when i put in the path for it.
Since networking is my specialty, vista is a hinderence to me right now. I use win 2k and Linux.”

“When we ordered this new machine Dell it was offered only with Vista so I also ordered XP Pro from a third party vendor. Glad I did. It didn't take long to get tired of being asked if I wanted to do what I was trying to get it to do.

The last straw was when I was trying to burn graphics files to DVD and Vista wouldn't let me. ? So I logged in as Administrator and ... Vista wouldn't let me move them. Might have something to do with the machine running in two Vista accounts simultaneously.”

“I do IT support, so I know a thing or two about computers, and even more about how impossible a task it would be to idiot-proof Windows (no offense to anyone). As an IT Pro. I deal with Windows issues daily, so solving and/or preventing Windows issues is not an problem for me in the slightest. However, at home I've been a Mac user since the rollout of OS X. I love that it is simple, that it is incredibly intuitive, and isn't really plagued by problems the way Windows is, either in type, volume, or severity. It's just easy to use, and while I know how to tell my computer what to do, be it Mac or PC, I'll always prefer to use the one that does it simpler.”


Holy Crap! Who wants to deal with all that!?


P.S. I didn't take the time to go through all the posts. This should be enough to make my point.

especially that last bit....

no reason to know or be bothered with all that at the least. I turn my computer on, it works. It runs windows crap, and the regular stuff. no issues no B.S. NEVER. why stick up for something that makes you work to get it to work? Give it up. Lol. DW's PC this week told her it wouldn't shut down because updates needed to be installed. It took more than three hours to "install" them. when she restarted the next day, t told her they had not been installed, then Bill Gates decided that she didn't need them installed, so her computer hangs for three hours every time she shuts it down. At least her PC makes a nice nightlight. My installs...well...if they aren't done when i shut down, they wait and restart in the background without my knowing it the next day when i start up. GOSH Macs suck :LOL: yeah right. How's tha "plug-n-play" going BTW?
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