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Old 07-28-2005, 09:07 PM   #11
 
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Ah, oui . . . mais . . .

Most of the alcohol contained in any alcohol ingredient is cooked off during the preparation process.

In some sense, and you'll please excuse my sensibilities here, trying to substitute something for an alcohol based ingredient is sort of like trying to do real Texas BBQ without pork fat.

But as noted by Alton Brown on "Good Eats" -- most wines in recipes are there for the acid, not the alcohol. You can use red wine vinegar (Vinegar derives from the French "vin aigre" -- sour wine.), lemon juice, etc.

But you're going to cook off the significant amounts of alcohol. Why not just use what the recipe calls for?

Pork fat won't kill ya neither. :D
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Old 07-28-2005, 10:02 PM   #12
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Go back a couple of posts and check the link in Jennyema's post. It confirms that, in many cases, a significant amount of alcohol remains in most cooking.

However, unless you avoid alcohol for medical or religeous reasons, it's well worth the minor expense for the added punch to the flavor.
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Old 07-29-2005, 09:29 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daphne duLibre
But as noted by Alton Brown on "Good Eats" -- most wines in recipes are there for the acid, not the alcohol.
This may be true, but some recipes need the alcohol specifically. There are some flavors that only come out in the presence of alcohol. The trick is knowing the reason the recipe calls for it in the first place.

On a side note, I was just in Trader Joes the other day and saw that they carry de-alcoholized wine. This is different than non alcoholic wine. This is a very good option for anyone who people who don't drink booze. Grahm Kerr (who is an alcoholic) uses de-alcoholized wine for any of his recipes that call for wine.
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Old 07-29-2005, 10:06 AM   #14
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True, GB, much of the time wine is used to both flavor the food directly and to dissolve alcohol soluable flavor components.

Alton also teaches this
http://serialized.net/archives/000055.html

But what is the difference between de-alcoholized wine and nonalcoholic wine?
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Old 07-29-2005, 10:34 AM   #15
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I actually don't know the difference Jenny. It has to do with the process of making the wine. Grahm Kerr was one of the first chefs that I got into on TV and I remember him talking a lot about it. He used to describe the difference, but I have long since forgotten. I seem to kind of remember him saying that de-alcoholized wines taste more like regular wine, but I could be wrong. I have never tried them myself as I enjoy the real thing
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Old 08-06-2005, 02:01 PM   #16
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From what I've been able to find from searching a bunch of sites on the web for a couple of days .... Non-Alcoholic and De-Alcoholized wines are the same thing - the only difference being semantics (both in the US and Europe). They are both wine which is processed to reduce the level of alcohol to 0.5% or less. According to USDA labeling laws - anything that is 0.5% or less is considered non-alcoholic.

It appears that there is no way to remove all of the alcohol. If you look at the cooking with wine/spirits charts that show how much alcohol remains in a dish based on time, temperature, cooking method, etc. - it never drops all the way to 0.0%.

Some people get so freaked out about the word alcohol. If you make a cake and use some vanilla extract in it - it contains some alcohol. If you use fresh vanilla beans - there is some alcohol. A slice of yeast leavened bread contains some alcohol (yeast produces 2 by-products .... CO2 and alcohol). Even fresh squeezed orange juice contains some alcohol (according to a couple of sites I found it could range between 0.2 - 0.5%)! Alcohol is used in the manufacturing of some drugs (either as a solvent or added for it's muscle relaxing properties) ... I'm sure the list goes on ....

Alcohol adds flavor, extract flavors, or enhance flavors. It occurs naturally in nature and in some foods. I'm not advocating anyone go out and start drinking .... but rather suggesting that a little understanding and judicious use might produce a better dish than dumping immitation vanilla into a bowl of soup.

Daph - I think you're confusing South Carolina BBQ (primarily pork) with Texas BBQ (primarily beef). But, yeah - pig juice rules!
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Old 08-06-2005, 02:42 PM   #17
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Pig fat may not kill you - but if you are a Jew or a Muslim, then religious objections come into play.

(for the record, I am neither of the above!)
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Old 08-08-2005, 07:48 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ishbel
Daphne
Pig fat may not kill you - but if you are a Jew or a Muslim, then religious objections come into play.

(for the record, I am neither of the above!)
Also, Daphne, re the above, Texas BBQ is mostly beef!
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Old 08-14-2005, 04:59 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy M.
Daphne
Go back a couple of posts and check the link in Jennyema's post. It confirms that, in many cases, a significant amount of alcohol remains in most cooking.

However, unless you avoid alcohol for medical or religeous reasons, it's well worth the minor expense for the added punch to the flavor.
As is obvious in all of "his" posts, Daphne never fails to avoid the truth.
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