Thin Beef slices

[giggler]

I like beef stir fry, beef stroganoff, and Roulades, (Braciole)..

but the thin beef pieces seem so tough!

I usually choose Sirloin or Top Round, (Recently London Broil), and I just can't bring myself to cut up ribeye, as I love those on the grill as steaks..

1. What cut do y'all use?

2. Am I cutting it wrong? This whole "across the grain" thing eludes me..

3. Is my cooking time wrong? I can't really picture any of these dishes being served Rare..

maybe I should cook them longer until the meat gets Tender?

Thanks, Eric, Austin tx.

 

[CraigC]

I like beef stir fry, beef stroganoff, and Roulades, (Braciole)..

but the thin beef pieces seem so tough!

I usually choose Sirloin or Top Round, (Recently London Broil), and I just can't bring myself to cut up ribeye, as I love those on the grill as steaks..

1. What cut do y'all use?

2. Am I cutting it wrong? This whole "across the grain" thing eludes me..

3. Is my cooking time wrong? I can't really picture any of these dishes being served Rare..

maybe I should cook them longer until the meat gets Tender?

Thanks, Eric, Austin tx.

Of the three examples you mention, the only one I'd use less tender cuts for would be the roulades (I call them rollatinis). I'll usually use thin bottom round for these. They get thin from my use of a mallet. They get tender via marinade. If you intend to use a short cooking time, IMO, the cut needs to be a tender one. Tougher cuts do well when braised or BBQed, such as a brisket.

Craig

 

[Claire]

I certainly wouldn't use ribeye for long cooking, stewed type meals. And yes, cutting is the thing.

Lately my favorite cut for these types of meals is flat iron steaks. Chuck is great and very flavorful. For cutting across the grain, take off a slice and look at the new edge. If the meat's natural grain seems to be horizontal, you are cutting with the grain. Not what you want. Rotate the meat 45 degrees. With some cuts the grain will be vertical to the cutting board. In that case it doesn't matter where you start. Slice thin and at a slant to the cutting board.

Yes, for things like stroganof, you want to first brown with your aromatic vegs, then cover with liquid, and cook at a bare simmer for a very long time.

For stir fries, I like to cut, then sprinkle generously with maggi seasoning. This is a fairly new product in my repetoir, and if you are sensitive to MSG - NO. In our case, no one in the house has a problem with it. Another hint is a sprinkling of sugar. Not a lot mind you, and not for a long time. But it is surprising how much tenderizing power sugar has (learned this from Korean recipes). If you're doing an Indian type curry, a bit of yogurt is a great tenderizer. with either of these (sugar, yogurt) you can't let it go on for long (a couple of hours, not over night). Remember yogurt is alive, and I swear it will eat your meat. In both cases I've left it overnight and awakened to mush.

 

[Steve Kroll]

Stroganoff should be made using a good cut of meat (one of my favorite uses for leftover prime rib), but for stir fries, any flat meat such as skirt, flat iron, or hanger steak works great. Just slice it across the grain. One tip for getting real thin slices is to put the meat in the freezer for 15 minutes to firm it up before slicing.

 

[Constance]

I haven't tried it, but I read somewhere (on here, I think) that Oriental restaurants marinate their meat in milk to make it tender for the stir-fries.

 

[texherp]

I made a stir-fry the other day. I just buy a pack of assorted stew meat pieces to cut up small and it works out great. I know it's kind of a gamble because you don't know what cuts they're from, but I swear by it. It kinda goes along with the original spirit of the dish, which I believe is to use up leftover scraps of meat.

I cut them up really thin (sometime I just end up with little fragments of meat) and marinate them in this Korean barbeque sauce which is mostly chilis, vinegar, and a little sugar. I think the vinegar is key because I think acidity tenderizes meat. When I stir-fry it, I cook the meat on its own, just until it's done and no more, allowing for the little bit of additional cooking that goes on after you take them off.

 

[Steve Kroll]

I haven't tried it, but I read somewhere (on here, I think) that Oriental restaurants marinate their meat in milk to make it tender for the stir-fries.

Not in milk - or at least not that I've heard of- but many use a process called "velveting" that involves dredging the meat in corn starch or soaking in soy sauce and corn starch blend that helps keep the meat from toughening when being fried over high heat. I use a lot of cheap cuts of meat (eye of round, for example) when making stir fry and the velveting helps keep it tender.

 

[taxlady]

For the roulades, you don't need to cut against the grain. You should roll them with the grain the long way. That way you will cut against the grain when you slice it when it's done. (Or if they are little, individual ones, when they are cut into mouthfuls on the plate.)

For stroganoff, I like to use bits of beef tenderloin that aren't really suitable for other food, e.g., the pointy bit at the tip end, and the "butt".

For stir fry, I would do as Steve suggests: velveting. I just learned about this recently and I know I have eaten meat done that way. It is tender. I gotta try this out soon.

 

[PolishedTopaz]

Just a note on milk and meat, in the Bolonaise Sauce that I do, the recipe calls to cook the meat {beef, pork & veal combo} in milk before adding all the other ingredients. This does act as a tenderizer for ground proteins, something to do with the enzymes in the milk.
Sorry for the highjack.

 

[Greg Who Cooks]

I like beef stir fry, beef stroganoff...

2. Am I cutting it wrong? This whole "across the grain" thing eludes me..

3. Is my cooking time wrong? I can't really picture any of these dishes being served Rare..

maybe I should cook them longer until the meat gets Tender?

Cross the grain is correct. Whatever direction you can tear the meat in, that's the grain: cut 90 degres across that, when possible.

You didn't say what your cooking time is. I use filet mignon for my Beef Stroganoff, thinly sliced (about 1/8"). It's fully cooked in about 60-120 seconds.

Some may disagree with my choice of filet mignon. It is the most tender cut or one of the most tender cuts, and thinly sliced it cooks in little more than an instant, as I stated above.

Cooking thin slices longer will make them tough. If you want to tenderize meat with long cooking times you need thick cuts and braising.


My guess is that you're cooking your meat too long.

 

[taxlady]

Cross the grain is correct. Whatever direction you can tear the meat in, that's the grain: cut 90 degres across that, when possible.

You didn't say what your cooking time is. I use filet mignon for my Beef Stroganoff, thinly sliced (about 1/8"). It's fully cooked in about 60-120 seconds.

Some may disagree with my choice of filet mignon. It is the most tender cut or one of the most tender cuts, and thinly sliced it cooks in little more than an instant, as I stated above.

Cooking thin slices longer will make them tough. If you want to tenderize meat with long cooking times you need thick cuts and braising.


My guess is that you're cooking your meat too long.

Are you using the term "filet mignon" to mean specifically the "filet mignon" or generically to mean "beef tenderloin"? That's what most of the grocery stores around here do. Then they sell stuff labelled "chateaubriand" and "tornedos" and it didn't come from anywhere near the tenderloin.

 

[CharlieD]

Using flank stake sliced against grain would work.

 

[Greg Who Cooks]

Are you using the term "filet mignon" to mean specifically the "filet mignon" or generically to mean "beef tenderloin"?

Let's say generic. I usually buy a small FM steak because that's about the right amount of meat for cooking for one. Tenderloins are usually too big for my purposes.

In any case I would pick a tender cut for recipes like Beef Stroganoff. It's not the kind of recipe to use tough cuts and expect them to become tender in the pan. But perhaps I'm wrong. All I know is what works for me. I'm no expert.

 

[Andy M.]

...Some may disagree with my choice of filet mignon. It is the most tender cut or one of the most tender cuts, and thinly sliced it cooks in little more than an instant, as I stated above...

I agree with your choice. Stroganoff is a quick cook dish, not a low and slow dish. As such, you really have to use a tender cut of meat to get it right.

taxlady, tenderloin refers to the entire primal cut. Filet mignon is a steak cut from the tenderloin. Chateaubriand is a roast cut from the center of the tenderloin.

 

[Timothy]

Not in milk - or at least not that I've heard of- but many use a process called "velveting" that involves dredging the meat in corn starch or soaking in soy sauce and corn starch blend that helps keep the meat from toughening when being fried over high heat. I use a lot of cheap cuts of meat (eye of round, for example) when making stir fry and the velveting helps keep it tender.

Here's a good page on Velveting red meats:
Chinese Batter Technique (Velveting)

 

[Greg Who Cooks]

Thanks Andy. And upon further thought, I can't really say I even cut the FM across the grain. I haven't made it for a while and when I do it I cut more for uniform size pieces (something difficult to do unless you find a rectangular steak which of course you don't). FM is so tender that the grain might not even matter. Probably.

In Beef Stroganoff I've selected the meat almost solely based upon its tenderness. IMO filet mignon doesn't have a lot of taste compared to other steaks. If I want a tasty steak I get ribeye. In the Stroganoff the taste of the meat (or lack thereof) is disguised by the relatively strong sauce. The sauce provides the flavor, the FM provides the tenderness. I'd never serve a FM steak with nothing on it. If I'm eating plain steak I'll get ribeye every time.

I think the OP has picked the wrong steak (sirloin, top round, London broil) and is probably overcooking. He says he doesn't want to use ribeye because he can't bear cutting one up since it tastes so good on the grill. I think if he's not willing to buy a filet mignon then he should get some ribeye, trim off all the fat, and then slice it up. I think it's quite possible the ribeye might taste better in Stroganoff because of the additional fat from the marbling. Which is why of course I choose ribeye for grilled steaks.

Try it once as an experiment. Ribeye or filet mignon, cut it up, Stroganoff recipe, stop cooking before all the pink is gone. When it turns brown through and through it's overcooked and it will be tough.

As far as stir fry, pretty much the same thing. One of the biggest reasons people like to stir fry is because of the short cooking time. Long cooking times will result in overcooked vegetables and tough meat.

 

[Andy M.]

I've used sirloin strip and ribeye in stroganoff. Delicious.

I think you're right about cutting with or against the grain with FM. Doesn't matter. I often cut my FM with a fork. How tough can it get?

On the other hand, I have no issue with eating plain FM seasoned with salt and pepper only. No, it doesn't taste like a ribeye but it still tastes great to me.

 

[Greg Who Cooks]

For me it's mostly that filet mignon is more expensive and ribeye is less expensive and has more marbling. I like lots of horseradish and occasionally steak sauce. The taste of the FM is more delicate. The marbling in the ribeye cuts through the horseradish and steak sauce.

Maybe the OP might succeed with extremely thin slices of a less tender cut, thin like you'd cut for shabu-shabu, like maybe 1/16th inch and across the grain. However for stir fry or Stroganoff I'd rather have more chew feel in the bites, perhaps 1/8" to 1/4". I think each chef has to decide just how they prefer to prepare these dishes. After all, nobody uses a ruler. You cut whatever thickness is right for what you're cooking at the time. If it doesn't come out perfectly you change your technique the next time you cook it.

 

[taxlady]

I agree with your choice. Stroganoff is a quick cook dish, not a low and slow dish. As such, you really have to use a tender cut of meat to get it right.

taxlady, tenderloin refers to the entire primal cut. Filet mignon is a steak cut from the tenderloin. Chateaubriand is a roast cut from the center of the tenderloin.

We use the terms similarly, but not exactly the same. I use the terms the way I learned them from Joy of Cooking. I just wouldn't use the filet mignon (little filet) for Stroganoff.

I would use the funny shaped pieces at either end of tenderloin, the primal cut, for Stroganoff. I'm cheap. A whole tenderloin usually costs about half as much per pound as smaller pieces. I cut it up and freeze it in ready to use pieces. Okay, on those rare occasions I decide to spring for tenderloin.

 

[Andy M.]

...I would use the funny shaped pieces at either end of tenderloin, the primal cut, for Stroganoff. I'm cheap. A whole tenderloin usually costs about half as much per pound as smaller pieces. I cut it up and freeze it in ready to use pieces. Okay, on those rare occasions I decide to spring for tenderloin.

Yes, if you have a whole tenderloin, those odds and ends are what to use for a strognoff. Greg was buying meat to make the dish for one person so a FM is how you have to go. I haven't seen tenderloin scraps in the supermarket.