"Discover Cooking, Discuss Life."

Go Back   Discuss Cooking - Cooking Forums > General Cooking Information > Cookware and Accessories > Appliances
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 07-28-2013, 05:47 PM   #11
Executive Chef
 
bakechef's Avatar
Site Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 4,082
Dual fuel would be the best of both worlds!

I've never seen the appeal of consumer grade gas cooktops, or maybe I've never used a good one. Water seems to boil slower, they throw off a lot of heat. I will say that they are much more responsive than an electric burner. Something like this Wolf or Viking seem like they would be a good step up from the run of the mill gas cooktops though.
__________________

__________________
I'm Bloggin'

http://bakingbetter.com
bakechef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-28-2013, 07:39 PM   #12
Executive Chef
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: here
Posts: 3,612
Bakechef, I think you're right, even though gas is cheaper than electricity here. Andy already convinced me, although youd convince me too. There are people here on the forum that you can get authoritative advice from and you two are both in that group.

The Wolf does have convection, in fact it has 10 cooking modes! "Ten cooking modes—bake, roast, broil, convection bake, convection roast, convection broil, convection, bake stone (accessory required), dehydrate (accessory required) and proof." The Wolf oven cycles just like yours does in at least one of its modes.

You wish you had the budget for this kind of high end cooking gear, I wish I was your age. My career is over, I have all I'll ever have. I've got my dream house, something I worked the last 30 years of my career for. My income is small (only Social Security) and thanks to the government my savings is dwindling as fast as they can print money. I might as well buy everything durable right now (anything that will last for the rest of my life, perhaps 25-30 years if I'm lucky). One really big factor with going with the high end is that I'll live in this house for the rest of my life and I'm buying gear that is very likely to outlast me. It's the last cooktop and oven I'll ever need or want, and I'm young enough to get years of use out of it. It's like the LED lighting I wrote the other article about. Might not work for people who are going to move in a few or several years, makes perfect sense for somebody who is retired in their last home and planning on living there long enough to get the full return on their investment. I might as well get everything I want that is durable right now, because money is going out of style thanks to our stupid government's policies, thanks to a stupid Congress, thanks to voters who let these clowns run the show. (But I'm digressing into areas not appropriate for the forum so that's all I'll say.)

Andy, I didn't think for a minute you were equating gas and electric cooktops. I'm sure you'll agree that nobody above novice chef level would even consider an electric cooktop. Without going into detail, even the single quality that you can go from zero to 100 mph in only an instant, and that you can see how hot it is by the size of the flame, no serious chef would ever consider cooking on anything but gas. That will never happen until we have mass replicators and we can just purchase gourmet recipes that instantly replicate with the touch of a button (probably voice control by then). But there'll still be people like us who enjoy going through the steps of cooking as some sort of meditation or hobby or enjoyable activity.

Bakechef, the appeal of consumer cooktops is the price. They start around $300 or so. And my analysis of the situation is that the difference between professional gear (or high end consumer gear) is the amount of heat they put out, I haven't researched it but I'll bet there are few if any ordinary consumer cooktops that can put out 15,000-16,000 BTU. Let alone all the other features including the double burners, totally sealed cooktop, continuous grate (so you can slide pots and pans easily), and the solid "lasts forever" construction.

Oh and another really sweet deal I just discovered on Wolf's site: they have a "Take your dream kitchen campaign home" program going that offers $1,000 savings on various products or product combinations, including $1,000 off the Wolf cooktop and oven I've discussed above. That takes the estimated $7,500 down to $6,500!
__________________

__________________
Greg Who Cooks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-28-2013, 07:51 PM   #13
Sous Chef
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: California's Big Valley
Posts: 810
I have a 36" free standing Wolf. We bought it when we remodeled the kitchen in our old house 28 years ago and it came with us when we built this house 18 years ago. It's been a faithful work horse. Two sisters and a niece have the same stove in their homes after we got ours. I would buy the same stove today. It's a stove, not a gimmick.
__________________
Oldvine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-28-2013, 08:33 PM   #14
Executive Chef
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: here
Posts: 3,612
Thanks for the reply Oldvine! Yeah I can tell that just because. I don't know. I just know that I'll be 100 in somewhat over 30+ years and that I strongly believe this Wolf cooktop and oven will last more than 30+ years. I'm going to live here until/unless I either need assisted living or I croak. It will surely be the last money I ever spend on a cooktop, oven, range, etc. For me this is a permanent solution.

It will solve my cooking needs for the rest of my life or at least as long as I'm capable of living on my own (unassisted). And if I move to assisted living this investment will contribute to the value of selling my house. And one of my goals in life--I have no children--is to spend my last penny on the same day that I breathe my last breath. That's why I will buy this expensive cooking setup. You live only once--as far as I know, and if you live more than once it's sure you can't take it with you.

I'm going to research a bit more, but at this point unless somebody convinces me otherwise I'm going to buy he Wolf gas cooktop and electric oven, apply the $1K offer, and I'll be cooking on Wolf in a few weeks.

So that's why I'm not keeping my current cooktop clean. It will be out of here within a week or 10 days.
__________________
Greg Who Cooks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-28-2013, 08:38 PM   #15
Executive Chef
 
bakechef's Avatar
Site Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 4,082
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Who Cooks View Post
Bakechef, I think you're right, even though gas is cheaper than electricity here. Andy already convinced me, although youd convince me too. There are people here on the forum that you can get authoritative advice from and you two are both in that group.

The Wolf does have convection, in fact it has 10 cooking modes! "Ten cooking modes—bake, roast, broil, convection bake, convection roast, convection broil, convection, bake stone (accessory required), dehydrate (accessory required) and proof." The Wolf oven cycles just like yours does in at least one of its modes.

You wish you had the budget for this kind of high end cooking gear, I wish I was your age. My career is over, I have all I'll ever have. I've got my dream house, something I worked the last 30 years of my career for. My income is small (only Social Security) and thanks to the government my savings is dwindling as fast as they can print money. I might as well buy everything durable right now (anything that will last for the rest of my life, perhaps 25-30 years if I'm lucky). One really big factor with going with the high end is that I'll live in this house for the rest of my life and I'm buying gear that is very likely to outlast me. It's the last cooktop and oven I'll ever need or want, and I'm young enough to get years of use out of it. It's like the LED lighting I wrote the other article about. Might not work for people who are going to move in a few or several years, makes perfect sense for somebody who is retired in their last home and planning on living there long enough to get the full return on their investment. I might as well get everything I want that is durable right now, because money is going out of style thanks to our stupid government's policies, thanks to a stupid Congress, thanks to voters who let these clowns run the show. (But I'm digressing into areas not appropriate for the forum so that's all I'll say.)

Andy, I didn't think for a minute you were equating gas and electric cooktops. I'm sure you'll agree that nobody above novice chef level would even consider an electric cooktop. Without going into detail, even the single quality that you can go from zero to 100 mph in only an instant, and that you can see how hot it is by the size of the flame, no serious chef would ever consider cooking on anything but gas. That will never happen until we have mass replicators and we can just purchase gourmet recipes that instantly replicate with the touch of a button (probably voice control by then). But there'll still be people like us who enjoy going through the steps of cooking as some sort of meditation or hobby or enjoyable activity.

Bakechef, the appeal of consumer cooktops is the price. They start around $300 or so. And my analysis of the situation is that the difference between professional gear (or high end consumer gear) is the amount of heat they put out, I haven't researched it but I'll bet there are few if any ordinary consumer cooktops that can put out 15,000-16,000 BTU. Let alone all the other features including the double burners, totally sealed cooktop, continuous grate (so you can slide pots and pans easily), and the solid "lasts forever" construction.

Oh and another really sweet deal I just discovered on Wolf's site: they have a "Take your dream kitchen campaign home" program going that offers $1,000 savings on various products or product combinations, including $1,000 off the Wolf cooktop and oven I've discussed above. That takes the estimated $7,500 down to $6,500!
I'm not arguing that gas can be superior to electric, but with sub $1000 ranges coils outperform gas when it comes to heat output. This comes from Consumer reports testing. You need pro-sumer or professional grades to get the needed btu for truly superior cooking compared to electric. Induction is the only thing that comes close to gas for responsiveness. There is a common misconception that gas is always superior to electric but that isn't at all true with consumer grade ranges. Now in the sub $1000 range there are terrible electric stoves as well as terrible gas ranges. My experience with electric has been mostly GE brand and those rate consistently good in tests. With my Samsung electric smooth top, I have no problems getting a pan ripping hot and keeping it there for good searing, same with the GE coil that I had in an apartment, they both boil water very fast. I do find that I need to move the pan off the burner at times, which I wouldn't likely need to do with gas. My mom's Kenmore (fridgidaire) I'm much less impressed with the cook top, it's slow. One thing that I really love about electric is simmering, because the heat isn't always on, it can maintain a slow simmer for long periods of time without scorching, something nearly impossible with lower end gas stoves (think tomato sauce and chili) . I can bet that what you are looking at will have a simmer function where the burners go on and off. I have a friend with a big Wolf range that has this feature.

It's all about what works well for you. For me right now in my kitchen electric is the way to go, I can set the burners to the pan size which helps keep them from heating up my small kitchen, I don't have a vent that vents to the outside to pull out that extra heat. If I had a larger home or was setting up my last home like you are, and had the budget, I'd have an awesome gas cook top, and a big vent!
__________________
I'm Bloggin'

http://bakingbetter.com
bakechef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-28-2013, 09:09 PM   #16
Chef Extraordinaire
 
GotGarlic's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Southeastern Virginia
Posts: 16,839
We have a 30" Jenn-Air gas stove/oven that has pretty much all the features you mentioned (I'm not at home, so I can't check). It has one burner that has 14,000 btus and a simmer burner that does a great job. It also has a double ring burner that has a wide range of heat levels. For me, the extra 1 or 2,000 btus wouldn't be worth the extra $4k. But I don't have that kind of money to spend :-)
__________________
The trouble with eating Italian food is that five or six days later you're hungry again. ~ George Miller
GotGarlic is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-28-2013, 10:57 PM   #17
Executive Chef
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: here
Posts: 3,612
Thanks all for the advice...

Garlic, either solution (Wolf, Viking) is only 14-15 KBTU, and virtually the same price within mere dollars. AFAIK both are sold only at my local Pacific Sales (store). The store is closed on Sunday, I feature a trip to their store tomorrow. I see no reason why I can't order my stuff tomorrow.

I hope I can get a consult on whether the cooktop and oven will fit into my kitchen design, and of course how much it will cost. But I'm up for $7K if that's what it takes. This is the last gear of this type I'll ever need for the rest of my life. If it takes $7K to settle the matter, then as Charlie says, "Bring it!"
__________________
Greg Who Cooks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-28-2013, 11:18 PM   #18
Executive Chef
 
bakechef's Avatar
Site Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 4,082
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Who Cooks View Post
Thanks all for the advice...

Garlic, either solution (Wolf, Viking) is only 14-15 KBTU, and virtually the same price within mere dollars. AFAIK both are sold only at my local Pacific Sales (store). The store is closed on Sunday, I feature a trip to their store tomorrow. I see no reason why I can't order my stuff tomorrow.

I hope I can get a consult on whether the cooktop and oven will fit into my kitchen design, and of course how much it will cost. But I'm up for $7K if that's what it takes. This is the last gear of this type I'll ever need for the rest of my life. If it takes $7K to settle the matter, then as Charlie says, "Bring it!"
Keep us posted, I'm excited to find out what you pick!
__________________
I'm Bloggin'

http://bakingbetter.com
bakechef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-28-2013, 11:27 PM   #19
Certified Pretend Chef
 
Andy M.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 41,344
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Who Cooks View Post
Thanks all for the advice...

Garlic, either solution (Wolf, Viking) is only 14-15 KBTU, and virtually the same price within mere dollars. AFAIK both are sold only at my local Pacific Sales (store). The store is closed on Sunday, I feature a trip to their store tomorrow. I see no reason why I can't order my stuff tomorrow.

I hope I can get a consult on whether the cooktop and oven will fit into my kitchen design, and of course how much it will cost. But I'm up for $7K if that's what it takes. This is the last gear of this type I'll ever need for the rest of my life. If it takes $7K to settle the matter, then as Charlie says, "Bring it!"
Have you read any reviews on the two cooktops and oven?
__________________
"If you want to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first create the universe." -Carl Sagan
Andy M. is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-28-2013, 11:41 PM   #20
Executive Chef
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: here
Posts: 3,612
Oh I will Bakechef!

I've gone from 0 to 100 MPH just today, and I realize that (1) I'll have to pay $? to get my GE Profile cooktop fixed (my home inspector warned me, "needs service," and my RE agent assured me, "it probably just needs cleaning." My oven will require $60 for the home warranty people to even come out, although I'm pretty sure that will cover it...

Or I can just go for the Wolf. I don't know why I've built up a preference of Wolf over Viking. But they're both sold at the same store (Pacific Sales, here in Valencia) and they're open tomorrow morning. I hope they have both models in their showroom.The only remaining obstacle is getting their assurance and commitment for installation price.

As far as I'm concerned I could be cooking on Wolf or Viking by this next weekend. It's never going to be less expensive and I have all the money I'll ever have for the res of my life, and living in the house I intend to live in for the rest of my life. According to the advice in the topic it looks like a simple choice: Wolf or Viking?

I should have an answer by tomorrow (Monday) or Tuesday, and a planned installation date. Unless somebody brings up a wild card (another leading brand) it looks like either (1) Wolf or (2) Viking. And I don't know why, I'm leaning to the Wolf. I've had to make so many intuitive decisions the last 5-6 weeks that I'm leaning towards my left/intuitive brain decision: Wolf. I've made so many intuitive, non-analytic decisions in the last several weeks and my intuition has not failed me once.

Maybe being intuitively clever is better than being analytically smart? I've been an engineer in my career and analystic thinking has ruled my life. I'm retired now, and maybe I should hark to intuition.

I intuit that I'll be cooking on Wolf in about a week...
__________________

__________________
Greg Who Cooks is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
cook

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



» Discuss Cooking on Facebook

Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:46 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.