30" gas cooktop: Wolf, Viking, or ???
- Thread starter Greg Who Cooks
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bakechef
Executive Chef
Congrats Greg, I wish everyone could feel the appreciation that you do with what they have.
Addie is right, so many young people want everything NOW, and until recently easy credit made it possible, times they are a changing, and people that are my age (30's) the attitudes are changing, we're becoming more frugal.
I'm a frugal guy, but I have my limits. We work hard and we have a nice home for people our age, do we have friends with nicer, fancier homes? Yes, but we feel fortunate for having what we do. I can talk myself out of most purchases, but sometimes have to let go and crack open the wallet. Recently I bought a 60" TV, I had myself talked out of it, but decided a little splurge doesn't hurt once in a while. We do most of our movie watching at home and it's something that we'll get a lot of use from. It was a good priced set, not elaborate at all just a big beautiful screen that we can afford.
We have enough available credit available to gut my kitchen and get my dream kitchen, but we don't like living to make payments on everything we own. We make the best use of what we have, and enjoy it. We have a plan in mind for the kitchen in the future, but we'll only do it when we have the money for it.
Addie is right, so many young people want everything NOW, and until recently easy credit made it possible, times they are a changing, and people that are my age (30's) the attitudes are changing, we're becoming more frugal.
I'm a frugal guy, but I have my limits. We work hard and we have a nice home for people our age, do we have friends with nicer, fancier homes? Yes, but we feel fortunate for having what we do. I can talk myself out of most purchases, but sometimes have to let go and crack open the wallet. Recently I bought a 60" TV, I had myself talked out of it, but decided a little splurge doesn't hurt once in a while. We do most of our movie watching at home and it's something that we'll get a lot of use from. It was a good priced set, not elaborate at all just a big beautiful screen that we can afford.
We have enough available credit available to gut my kitchen and get my dream kitchen, but we don't like living to make payments on everything we own. We make the best use of what we have, and enjoy it. We have a plan in mind for the kitchen in the future, but we'll only do it when we have the money for it.
OP
OP
Greg Who Cooks
Executive Chef
It's not that young people haven't learned the lesson of working hard and being frugal and spending their money intelligently. Rather, the government and Corporate America are actively encouraging people to go into debt, and have been for quite some time. That's what caused the housing price crash, politicians and Wall St. decided that everybody deserved to own a home and they threw common sense out the window. Wall St. got rich selling mortgage derivatives, house builders got rich building tracts, people got greedy seeing their home values go up and refinanced on the new bubble of value their house had then spent it on extravagant vacations, fancy cars, needless remodeling of their houses... As it turned out it isn't common sense that everybody should own their own house, the common sense is that you have to work hard and manage your money carefully to deserve a house. Or in my case, to afford top end kitchen appliances.
The same forces are still at work today, people are encouraged to keep in debt and buy things they can't afford. The government likes it that way because people are more controllable. Don't play along and you lose your house. Corporate America likes it that way because they're milking the consuming public and transferring wealth from people to corporations.
My own complaint is that people who manage their money wisely get dragged along in the flood of greedy, thoughtless, stupid people. I manage my own money wisely but the housing crash cost me my job and ended my career early. It's only the combination of my frugality and plain dumb luck that ended up with my owning a nice house and nice kitchen appliances. That same frugality plus bad luck would have ended me up in a dingy neighborhood with an old house and cooking on a $400 stove for the rest of my life. The good luck made it happen but it was the frugality, intelligent personal finance management and hard work that made it possible.
Well, enough of a rant.
Just a few comments about the gear. When Wolf means "high broil" they really mean high! I incinerated a bagel recently having not learned that. Today I gave my bagel about 15 seconds on each side and it came out fine. I had been used to a minute on each side in my old stove.
Those burners really accelerate fast too! I guess that's a professional feature, that chefs don't have time to wait around for pots to boil while customers are complaining that their food hasn't been served yet. But you have to watch things closely when the heat is high because just like the bagel you can crisp whatever used to take 10 minutes in a minute with 15,000 BTU!
The cooking surface under the grates is really easy to clean. There's just two grates and the entire top area is flat so you can slide pans around. Remove the grates and there are sealed burners and stainless steel. A quick wipe with paper towels and maybe a bit of glass cleaner will clean most small spills and splatters. By the way, stainless steel appliances require special cleaner (other than window cleaner) and must be rubbed along with the grain or you'll ruin the nice appearance. I found that out a few weeks ago when my cousin lectured me about my stainless fridge, and it applies to the cooktop and oven too (even says it in the manuals, and you get a free sample with the appliance).
The Viking had standard oven control knobs, the Wolf has an electronic touch panel. I've gotten used to the GE's oven touch panel and I like it, and I like the Wolf too. One of Wolf's frill features I sort of like, you touch a tab at the bottom of the panel and the control panel rotates 180 degrees and shows just a plain stainless steel surface. Or you can leave the controls exposed and the clock shows the time if you like. I've got so many clocks I don't need that.
Another interesting oven feature, if you set a timer part of the control panel shows what time it will be when the timed period is over. You don't have to mentally add the countdown time to the clock time.
Even after you've cooked your meal and turn off the oven the fans continue to operate until the oven gets down to some degree of coolness. The hot air is exhausted out of a vent underneath the bottom edge of the front of the oven. That's going to be nice in cold weather!
The same forces are still at work today, people are encouraged to keep in debt and buy things they can't afford. The government likes it that way because people are more controllable. Don't play along and you lose your house. Corporate America likes it that way because they're milking the consuming public and transferring wealth from people to corporations.
My own complaint is that people who manage their money wisely get dragged along in the flood of greedy, thoughtless, stupid people. I manage my own money wisely but the housing crash cost me my job and ended my career early. It's only the combination of my frugality and plain dumb luck that ended up with my owning a nice house and nice kitchen appliances. That same frugality plus bad luck would have ended me up in a dingy neighborhood with an old house and cooking on a $400 stove for the rest of my life. The good luck made it happen but it was the frugality, intelligent personal finance management and hard work that made it possible.
Well, enough of a rant.
Just a few comments about the gear. When Wolf means "high broil" they really mean high! I incinerated a bagel recently having not learned that. Today I gave my bagel about 15 seconds on each side and it came out fine. I had been used to a minute on each side in my old stove.
Those burners really accelerate fast too! I guess that's a professional feature, that chefs don't have time to wait around for pots to boil while customers are complaining that their food hasn't been served yet. But you have to watch things closely when the heat is high because just like the bagel you can crisp whatever used to take 10 minutes in a minute with 15,000 BTU!
The cooking surface under the grates is really easy to clean. There's just two grates and the entire top area is flat so you can slide pans around. Remove the grates and there are sealed burners and stainless steel. A quick wipe with paper towels and maybe a bit of glass cleaner will clean most small spills and splatters. By the way, stainless steel appliances require special cleaner (other than window cleaner) and must be rubbed along with the grain or you'll ruin the nice appearance. I found that out a few weeks ago when my cousin lectured me about my stainless fridge, and it applies to the cooktop and oven too (even says it in the manuals, and you get a free sample with the appliance).
The Viking had standard oven control knobs, the Wolf has an electronic touch panel. I've gotten used to the GE's oven touch panel and I like it, and I like the Wolf too. One of Wolf's frill features I sort of like, you touch a tab at the bottom of the panel and the control panel rotates 180 degrees and shows just a plain stainless steel surface. Or you can leave the controls exposed and the clock shows the time if you like. I've got so many clocks I don't need that.
Another interesting oven feature, if you set a timer part of the control panel shows what time it will be when the timed period is over. You don't have to mentally add the countdown time to the clock time.
Even after you've cooked your meal and turn off the oven the fans continue to operate until the oven gets down to some degree of coolness. The hot air is exhausted out of a vent underneath the bottom edge of the front of the oven. That's going to be nice in cold weather!
roadfix
Chef Extraordinaire
Well, you ended up with a beautiful setup. You only cry once when you buy the best. Congratulations!
Addie
Chef Extraordinaire
Greg, like you I handle my own money. It is not a lot each month, but it is mine. I do pay on line, thus save on stamps. But I refuse to sign up for automatic withdrawals. For my cable bill, I always round up to the next five or zero dollar. Drives Comcast crazy. They call me every month and ask if I want to upgrade. I now just hang up on them. Grant you I don't pay for my cell phone, but why should I allow them to use up my minutes? I have only one credit card and use it very wisely. I always make more than the minimum amount due.
The auto industry is now pulling the same scam for folks to buy or lease new cars that the housing and banking industry did to potential home buyers. Bad credit? No problem! No job? No problem! Just sign here and drive home in a new car.
Spike and I have had long talks about the folks that hit those mega big Lottery Jackpots. They always take the lump sum. After the Federal and State take their share of taxes out of the lump sum, and for cities that also have their taxes, you are left with almost two-thirds of that jackpot gone. And when you go to pick up your check, the State encourages you to take that lump sum so they can get a bigger share. Do the math folks. Take the 20 years payment plan. If you don't make it to the full 20 years, your kids will get the rest in a lump sum. By then the taxes will be lower. If you invest some of that yearly money into a trust fund for your family, you still have a lot of money left over to help your family.
By following a sensible plan, you too can afford to buy those great kitchen appliances that Greg now is the proud owner of.
The auto industry is now pulling the same scam for folks to buy or lease new cars that the housing and banking industry did to potential home buyers. Bad credit? No problem! No job? No problem! Just sign here and drive home in a new car.
Spike and I have had long talks about the folks that hit those mega big Lottery Jackpots. They always take the lump sum. After the Federal and State take their share of taxes out of the lump sum, and for cities that also have their taxes, you are left with almost two-thirds of that jackpot gone. And when you go to pick up your check, the State encourages you to take that lump sum so they can get a bigger share. Do the math folks. Take the 20 years payment plan. If you don't make it to the full 20 years, your kids will get the rest in a lump sum. By then the taxes will be lower. If you invest some of that yearly money into a trust fund for your family, you still have a lot of money left over to help your family.
By following a sensible plan, you too can afford to buy those great kitchen appliances that Greg now is the proud owner of.
roadfix
Chef Extraordinaire
I have not paid a dime in credit card interest in over 20 years. I carry and use only 1 credit card, use it only to make on-line purchases, and pay the balance in full each month. The bank still makes money each time I use my card.
I pay cash for my everyday purchases.....gas, groceries, etc...
Instead of carrying a 30 year mortgage I went with a 15 year instead, but had to work my butt off, working over 70 hour weeks for nearly 20 years to be able to pay off that mortgage. It's nice to be completely debt free, and have been for several years now.
And when time comes to eventually replace my appliances they will be high end.
I pay cash for my everyday purchases.....gas, groceries, etc...
Instead of carrying a 30 year mortgage I went with a 15 year instead, but had to work my butt off, working over 70 hour weeks for nearly 20 years to be able to pay off that mortgage. It's nice to be completely debt free, and have been for several years now.
And when time comes to eventually replace my appliances they will be high end.
Andy M.
Certified Pretend Chef
I'm with you on paying off the cc monthly. However, I use it for everything including gas and groceries. the points SO and I earn pays for vacation airfare every year.
Dawgluver
Chef Extraordinaire
- Joined
- Apr 12, 2011
- Messages
- 25,033
We pay ours off every month, and use it for everything too. We get the cash back option, a nice amount.
roadfix
Chef Extraordinaire
Hmmm....perhaps I should look into a rewards type CC.
Same here, but no cash, just "Canadian Tire money on the card" and PC points which can be used in those stores. Almost as good as cash, since I buy a lot of stuff at Canadian Tire and various grocery stores under the PC banner.
OP
OP
Greg Who Cooks
Executive Chef
The only times I've ever paid credit card interest is a few times when I wrote the wrong amount on the payment check, or once I thought I had made my payment but hadn't. I pay all my bills within days of coming in, because I don't live from paycheck to paycheck. If I can't afford something I don't buy it. I rarely buy expensive toys but I make sure they're ones that I'll really enjoy. Most of my hobbies and toys are inexpensive. I've never bought a car until I had enough money saved to pay cash. I've got 20,000 miles on my 7 year old car because I don't make frivolous trips and because I route my shopping to make several stops in the least amount of mileage.
One thing we all do that saves a lot of money: we enjoy cooking so we eat at home and the labor to make the meals is free. Actually, most of the time I prefer my own cooking anyway because it's an enjoyable activity and because I get it served exactly how I like it.
One thing we all do that saves a lot of money: we enjoy cooking so we eat at home and the labor to make the meals is free.
Actually, most of the time I prefer my own cooking anyway because it's an enjoyable activity and because I get it served exactly how I like it.
bakechef
Executive Chef
Heck yeah! Even with our modest budget, we can earn $200-300 a year. With discipline credit cards can be profitable!
With Greg's purchase, running it through a basic rewards card would yield $70 even if you paid it off the next day. There are cards that you can do even better with.
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Dawgluver
Chef Extraordinaire
- Joined
- Apr 12, 2011
- Messages
- 25,033
Chase Freedom gives you cash or points, and is very highly rated. Costco's Amex is highly rated too, and both cards will give 3% cash back on different things like groceries, gas, travel, restaurants, etc., a list that rotates quarterly. Everything else is 1%. Neither has annual fees.
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OP
OP
Greg Who Cooks
Executive Chef
That's exactly what I did and that's about what I added to my rewards (I get 1%). I put my new clothes washer and dryer on the card too. In fact I put almost everything I buy on the card. It's a mess to keep track of the charge drafts and reconcile them with your monthly statement but other than the labor of tracking it it's free money. I've done my best to put as much of my move-in expenses on the card to make the best of this expensive few months.
I put as many of my recurring monthly expenses on my card (cable TV & Internet, cellphone, land line, any business that will accept auto-payment via my credit card) to get rewards from them too, and I don't have to bother paying cellphone etc. separately each month.
Wow we're really getting way off topic but I don't really mind my topic getting destroyed, particularly if it helps somebody. Unfortunately I think we're all mainly preaching to the choir.
I've gone as paperless as I can, get my monthly statements online, then pay the ones that don't get settled via the credit card using my credit union's online bill payer. It costs nothing, payments to big companies (like my credit cards) go electronically, and my credit union sends the rest of them via USPS and absorbs the postage cost.
BTW you senior citizens on low income should look into discounts for such people, particularly utilities. My only utility I don't get a discount on is cable/Internet. Trash pick-up was even better, our trash pick-up is a fixed monthly fee but they have a deal: pay 11 months in advance and get the 12th month for free. That's about an 8% discount, and that's on top of my senior citizen low income discount! The nice lady even backdated my senior citizen and 11 months in advance discounts to my escrow closing day! (I drove over to their office because I figured I'd have a better chance of getting that than on the phone, and it worked perfectly!)
Lots of restaurants have senior discounts and I keep forgetting to ask if they have it. I know there's a fair amount of DC members who are senior citizens. In many cases the discount is given to those over 60 or 62, maybe some even lower.
So my topic is ruined but I don't care. I'm in my new retirement house/home and I'm well on the way to having my last/best kitchen I'll ever have. Once I get that Calphalon or All-Clad or whatever brand cookware I get I can't think of anything else I'll ever need except the ingredients themselves.
Then I'll have to move to the next frontier: patio cooking!
I put as many of my recurring monthly expenses on my card (cable TV & Internet, cellphone, land line, any business that will accept auto-payment via my credit card) to get rewards from them too, and I don't have to bother paying cellphone etc. separately each month.
Wow we're really getting way off topic but I don't really mind my topic getting destroyed, particularly if it helps somebody. Unfortunately I think we're all mainly preaching to the choir.
I've gone as paperless as I can, get my monthly statements online, then pay the ones that don't get settled via the credit card using my credit union's online bill payer. It costs nothing, payments to big companies (like my credit cards) go electronically, and my credit union sends the rest of them via USPS and absorbs the postage cost.
BTW you senior citizens on low income should look into discounts for such people, particularly utilities. My only utility I don't get a discount on is cable/Internet. Trash pick-up was even better, our trash pick-up is a fixed monthly fee but they have a deal: pay 11 months in advance and get the 12th month for free. That's about an 8% discount, and that's on top of my senior citizen low income discount! The nice lady even backdated my senior citizen and 11 months in advance discounts to my escrow closing day! (I drove over to their office because I figured I'd have a better chance of getting that than on the phone, and it worked perfectly!)
Lots of restaurants have senior discounts and I keep forgetting to ask if they have it. I know there's a fair amount of DC members who are senior citizens. In many cases the discount is given to those over 60 or 62, maybe some even lower.
So my topic is ruined but I don't care.
I'm in my new retirement house/home and I'm well on the way to having my last/best kitchen I'll ever have. Once I get that Calphalon or All-Clad or whatever brand cookware I get I can't think of anything else I'll ever need except the ingredients themselves.Then I'll have to move to the next frontier: patio cooking!
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So Greg, does your dishwasher have a removable panel?
bakechef
Executive Chef
Chase freedom is my most used card! I love that I can link it to amazon and use the points like cash.
OP
OP
Greg Who Cooks
Executive Chef
I did an initial search and so far I have no indication or results.
It's a Kitchen Aid KUDIO1DLWH6 if anybody has any ideas.
It would be pretty nice to have an all stainless steel kitchen. My preferences have always been appliance white (white always goes with white) but now that I'm 3/4 the way to an entirely stainless kitchen it seems like it would be worth the effort to go 100%.
By the way, the Sous Vide is all stainless!
roadfix
Chef Extraordinaire
I like stainless appliances, besides looking good, I think they are timeless, and bring a somewhat commercial element into the kitchen. They'll always remain fashionable, I think.
Also, if I ever, one day, have to replace my center island I'd lke to replace it with a heavy duty free standing commercial prep table.
I installed one SS table (24x60) in 1 corner of the kitchen a couple of years ago.
Also, if I ever, one day, have to replace my center island I'd lke to replace it with a heavy duty free standing commercial prep table.
I installed one SS table (24x60) in 1 corner of the kitchen a couple of years ago.
CWS4322
Chef Extraordinaire
I have thought the same (installing a prep station) instead of an island.
OP
OP
Greg Who Cooks
Executive Chef
There is a serious reason for stainless steel, particularly in commercial kitchens. It is indestructible particularly if all you're concerned about is utility. We amateurs want our SS to look pretty so we use the right cleaner and stroke it along the grain, but in a commercial kitchen the only factors are the ease of cleaning and the healthiness as food preparation surfaces.
AFAIK the only way you can abuse SS is to scratch it and to stain it. In a commercial kitchen stains make no matter. Scratches make it a bit harder to keep clean...
In our amateur kitchens of course SS is our pride and joy and we use the right polish and we wipe up acid spills before they can etch the steel, because unlike commercial kitchens to which utility is the only important matter, in our amateur kitchens the appearance is an important factor too.
