Arcane cooking terms

[mignon]

I wish to buy a carbon steel or black steel frying pan. I don't believe these terms are interchangeable, which is to say they differ from one another. The "great" Google is not so great — I have yet to discover what these terms mean or what the difference is.

As if that isn't bad enough, I've encountered the stupid description "lyon shaped handle" 43 million times. What in the heck is a lyon shaped frying pan handle? I'd be so grateful if a savvy kitchen person out there would educate me a little (or lot if he or she has the patience).

 

[Robo410]

a carbon steel pan is a heavy thick metal "frying pan" (sloped sided saute pan) made of carbon steel. It must be seasoned as it will rust otherwise. It can take very high heat and is great for searing meat and going from stove top to oven. THe Lyon handle is gently v shaped. deBuyer makes these pans. They also make a carbon steel straight sided saute pan. whether you see white steel, blue steel, or black steel, (the later two coated which you will wash partly off and begin the seasoning again, ) is pretty much immaterial. (different company have different finishing process.) Personally I like the deBuyer "white" carbon steel so I can start burning it in myself.

As with cast iron, just wash with brush and hot water and re oil. THe more you cook the blacker it gets.


Advantage over cast iron...in a fry pan/saute pan is quick heating.

I use mine a lot.

 

[Michael in FtW]

Just to add something to what Robo said - steel is an allow of iron and up to about 2% carbon. So, all steel is carbon steel.

In addition to some steel pots/pans being coated with a removable protective coating which must be removed before the pan is seasoned like cast iron, there are some steel pots/pans that are called white/red/blue/black (depends on the color used) steel which are coated with porcelain enamel - like the Le Creuset cast iron pots. These do not require seasoning.

 

[mignon]

Thank goodness for certified chefs. Now I know why my mother threatened to put me out for adoption if I ever touched her absolutely black pan or tried to wash it. It made the greatest over light eggs that ever lived.

You must complete my education. I haven't a clue what you (Robo410) mean by: "The Lyon handle is gentle v shaped." That's like telling me a corkscrew is gentle curve shaped! I don't understand.

My mother's pan had a flat metal handle that was riveted to the pan and angled up an inch or two from the rim. You had to use a pot holder when cooking with it or suffer a third degree burn. I'd love to know where I can buy a frying pan like that.

 

[Andy M.]

Carbon and Black Steel Pans

 

[mignon]

Andy, Thank you for that link — those pans look like the ticket, but I'm still being assaulted by those wretched words: "Lyon shaped frying pan." And I'm still asking — what the h... is a Lyon shaped frying pan?

How ridiculous can it get? What's different about the shape of those frying pans than the millions of all other frying pans in the world? Am I cuckoo or what?

 

[Andy M.]

Not cuckoo. Those pans are Lyon shaped. Straight sloped sides rather than curved sides and a flat bottom. Don't make it more complicated than it is.

 

[DrThunder88]

When I used Google Image Search, the first page of hits for "Lyon shaped pan" contained at least a few pictures of those types of pans. Individual results may vary, since Google "learns" about its users. And it may not give much an explanation, but sometimes a picture is worth at least a handful of words.

 

[mignon]

Please forgive me if I sound a little testy, but I'm starting to lose it. Isn't there anyone out there who can explain in kindergarden English what the difference is between Google's "Lyon shaped frying pans" and all the non-Lyon shaped frying pans in the rest of the world. (I think you guys are pulling my leg.)

For the purpose of illustrating what a "Lyon shaped frying pan" is, those pictures aren't worth a jar of warm spit as far as I can see.

 

[Fisher's Mom]

I don't think there is much difference between one frying pan and another, shape wise. Here's a link that has a description of why it is a lyon shaped pan.
Black Steel Lyon Shaped Frying Pan at FoodServiceDirect!
I'm assuming that the name has to do with the town of Lyon in France.

 

[Andy M.]

The first picture is of a lyon pan. Flat bottom and straight slanted sides.


The second picture is a frying pan. Flat bottom and curved slanted sides.


The third picture is a saute pan. Flat bottom and straignt right angle sides.

 

[Robo410]

terms differ from country to country. The Lyon pan is sometimes called a French pan, and if you go to parts Europe our fry pan here in the US is a saute pan and our saute pan is their fry pan.

What makes it desirable: 1) thick metal able to take and transmit heat, lots of it. 2) not expensive compared to stainless steel or other metals 3) darkens with age and use, easy to clean with hot water and a brush. 4) stove to oven no problem any temp you like.

drawbacks 1) moderately heavy 2) gets real HOT 3) can get rusty if not kept seasoned

The Lyon handle is slightly V shaped so the palm closes around it and the thumb sits in the top "indent". Pot holder or side towel required or you'll burn your hand.

THe differences between pans is subtle to see but great in actual use.
are you sauteing mushrooms? you want the sloping sides so you can toss/shake the food in the pan / are you pan frying chicken, you want the high straight sides to hold the oil and minimize splatters / are you searing meat before tossing it in the oven, then the Lyon or French pan is ideal beacuse of its metal and shape.

Could you have just one pan and do all these things? sure, most home cooks do. but you waont get "restaurant results"

 

[mignon]

Fisher's Mom:

This is the description you alluded to: "The traditional black steel Lyon shaped frying pan creates a generous food to heat ratio which allows for setting, scrambling and searing. The angled sides keep in steam and discourage dry frying. The flat, iron handle is solidly affixed"

That's all bilge as far as I'm concerned. I could say the same thing about a horse's a.. shaped frying pan.

 

[Andy M.]

Fisher's Mom:

This is the description you alluded to: "The traditional black steel Lyon shaped frying pan creates a generous food to heat ratio which allows for setting, scrambling and searing. The angled sides keep in steam and discourage dry frying. The flat, iron handle is solidly affixed"

That's all bilge as far as I'm concerned. I could say the same thing about a horse's a.. shaped frying pan.

mignon:

I'm not sure why you are getting angry at the people here who are trying to help you.

If none of the explanations and photos to date answer your questions, I'm not sure how we can help you any further.

 

[Robo410]

mignon, of course it is advertising twaddle, but how else to describe a round metal disk of 3mm thickness that has been "punched " into shape by an industrial metal mold press. frankly we could all be cooking on hot rocks over open fires, but that is not as easy or controllable or sanitary etc.

Cookware began in ancient times and basic shapes evolved for basic techniques of roasting stewing/braising, frying /sauteing, boiling/poaching etc

What to look for is quality and thickness of metal, type of metal for the job or style of cooking, handle shape and comfort, weight, cost, type of range/cooker. Copper is great for heat control but not if you have an induction range as it is not magnetic.

So the carbon steel Lyon pan is great for many things requiring heat or fats/oils. But it is a fry/saute pan.

 

[DrThunder88]

The first picture is of a lyon pan. Flat bottom and straight slanted sides.

The second picture is a frying pan. Flat bottom and curved slanted sides.

The third picture is a saute pan. Flat bottom and straignt right angle sides.

Odd. I've always called pan #2 a skillet and just refer to all pans designed for frying (deep frying generally excluded) "frying pans."

...And that's how dialectal disparities will destroy us all.

 

[Fisher's Mom]

Odd. I've always called pan #2 a skillet and just refer to all pans designed for frying (deep frying generally excluded) "frying pans."

...And that's how dialectal disparities will destroy us all.

I've had the same problem. It wasn't until I found DC that I learned the difference between a saute pan and a fry pan. I just called em all fry pans.

 

[mignon]

Would you believe it, even the "Cookware Manufacturer's Association" is stumped by the "Lyon shaped frying pan." I have yet to receive a response from them regarding this ubiquitously advertised product. Indeed, vendors selling "lyon shaped frying pans" have failed to respond to inquiries with any illuminating information, so far.

I may just seek psychological counseling, forget all this stuff, and opt to buy a couscoussier instead.

 

[PanchoHambre]

I believe I have seen the "lyon" pan as posted above generally referred to as a "Chef's" pan?

 

[Andy M.]

Would you believe it, even the "Cookware Manufacturer's Association" is stumped by the "Lyon shaped frying pan." I have yet to receive a response from them regarding this ubiquitously advertised product. Indeed, vendors selling "lyon shaped frying pans" have failed to respond to inquiries with any illuminating information, so far.

I may just seek psychological counseling, forget all this stuff, and opt to buy a couscoussier instead.

I need your help to understand what kind of description/explanation/definition you are seeking beyond what has already been offered.

Could you explain, please?