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Old 10-09-2008, 01:42 PM   #11
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The old saying if it sounds too good to be true it probably is applied here!
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Old 10-09-2008, 10:44 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by chef_william View Post
How many people get muggd off on eBay buying fake global knives!!

Really winds me up - how can people be so nieve to think they are truly getting a bargain on these knives - set of 12 knives for like 200???

Come on... do be serious!

Sorry, but i had to get it off my chest - it really winds me up!!
Reminds me back in the 1980's when a Taiwanese company essentially knocked-off Ping's investment cast/cavity-backed golf clubs ("Tournament Models.") $89.00 instead of $400.00 for the actual Pings.

I have no doubt that a capable manufacturer in a place like China could build high quality Global knock-offs and they could sell them for the price you posted if they did not have to incur Global's design, distribution, labor and marketing costs...
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Old 10-10-2008, 01:57 AM   #13
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My DW almost got suckered by a web site that promised access to luxury brands such as Coach, etc, at wholesale prices. $9.99 the first month and $19.95 a month after that. All they did was refer you to E-bay. How 'bout that?
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Old 10-10-2008, 04:13 AM   #14
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The notice from the K Sabatier website, and it doesn't get much plainer than this:

We received different complaints about products bought on ebay.

You need to be careful about these products.

The sellers claim that the products are genuine and legal, they are fully forged, high quality. They used our pictures to present the knives, some times they gave a link from their announces to our web site to guaranty the origin of the products. They write "BARGAIN", they received 3 "8pieces sets" for their weeding .. they have a good contact that works for a catering company ...

How can a Private Person sell tens and tens NEW Knives on ebay ?


THEY ARE LIARS

The products may be cheaper but for goods reasons : they are poor quality knives, manufacturing with cheap steel, poor quality standards, Made in China, and unsharped blades that will not hold an edge for more than a couple of uses. They are not Made in France, have no guaranty ....

Counterfeit goods put public safety at risk. Fake goods are produced very cheaply without our rigorous testing procedures. These knives are produce by children and adults who work in very bad conditions. Do you think it is good to buy these products ?

K SABATIER Knives are produced by SABATIER AINE & PERRIER, based to Thiers- FRANCE.
The knives are made in France from the forge to the packaging. Our knives are fully forged. They are hand-manufacturing to propose to our customers the best quality. This quality has a price.

We don't sell our production on ebay.
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Old 11-04-2008, 03:11 PM   #15
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The products may be cheaper but for goods reasons : they are poor quality knives, manufacturing with cheap steel, poor quality standards, Made in China, and unsharped blades that will not hold an edge for more than a couple of uses. They are not Made in France, have no guaranty ....
First "made in China" no longer means garbage. "Made in Japan" used to have the same connotation. No more.

What "quality standards" are you talking about? I have seen some vaunted Sabatiers and Jananeses knives that looked like they were banged out on the edge of the railroad tracks with a sledge hammer. Is that high "quality standards"?

Other than maybe tires, France is not exactly known as a world-leader in design and manufacturing. While it will be resisted for a long time, some might have to come to grip with the fact that a decent (not the best but decent) chefs knife can be had for $15-20.00. A FAR SUPERIOR knife to one costing the same amount 10-15 years ago...

Making knives isn't trivial but it's also not rocket science. Commanding high prices is more of a marketing than a design and manufacturing matter these days.
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Old 11-04-2008, 03:20 PM   #16
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commanding high prices is more of a marketing than a design and manufacturing matter these days.
amen!
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Old 11-04-2008, 06:19 PM   #17
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amen!
well, I have to disagree

tell you what, you make a knife..even a copy of one that costs maybe $250, then we'll talk about cost.

if we're going that route, there's no reason why dinner should cost 100/person.
for that matter, a burger shouldn't cost over about $5
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Old 11-04-2008, 08:33 PM   #18
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well, I have to disagree

tell you what, you make a knife..even a copy of one that costs maybe $250, then we'll talk about cost.

if we're going that route, there's no reason why dinner should cost 100/person.
for that matter, a burger shouldn't cost over about $5
Good response -- not.

For one of these ever so hot asian-style knives it would be something like:

* Stamp or laser cut a blank from coiled/sheet carbon or stainless

* Timesaver deburr

* Emboss name/model (or acid etch down the line after bead blasting)

* Hand-grind initial cutting edge (this could likely be roughed-out on a CNC machining center)

* Heat treat

* Bead blast or polish

* Finish grind/sharpen/hone by hand

* Final polish (if necessary)

* Epoxy-on 3rd party handle that I paid $2.00 for.

The only two processes that would be challenging would be figuring out the heat-treat recipe and being able to grind the cutting edge.

Without design or marketing expenses, I think the production costs for an outstanding carbon steel chefs knife could easily be held to under $10.00/knife.

Given their margins, I bet henckels and wusthof are not much more than that for most models. Of course their distribution, sales and marketing expenses are huge.
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Old 11-04-2008, 09:59 PM   #19
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well, it seems you want to be sarcastic..thats fine

exactly how many people are handeling this "magic" knife you just supposedly made for under $10?

you are showing your ignorance, I suggest you do some reading up on production methods of japanese handmade knives.

if you are refering to production knives such as kershaw, I can't speak for them.
Really, $2.00 for a ho wood handle with a horn ferrule? where did you manage that? The only supplier I know that sells them charges around 10-15/handle. The cheapest I found personally was $8, thats for a factory replacement handle ( I visited a few of the places that actually made these knives you say can be made so cheap while I was in japan a week ago)
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Old 11-05-2008, 03:56 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuy View Post
First "made in China" no longer means garbage. "Made in Japan" used to have the same connotation. No more.

What "quality standards" are you talking about? I have seen some vaunted Sabatiers and Jananeses knives that looked like they were banged out on the edge of the railroad tracks with a sledge hammer. Is that high "quality standards"?

Other than maybe tires, France is not exactly known as a world-leader in design and manufacturing. While it will be resisted for a long time, some might have to come to grip with the fact that a decent (not the best but decent) chefs knife can be had for $15-20.00. A FAR SUPERIOR knife to one costing the same amount 10-15 years ago...

Making knives isn't trivial but it's also not rocket science. Commanding high prices is more of a marketing than a design and manufacturing matter these days.
Good quality products sell under their own names, and are not counterfeit productions of someone else's intellectual property. That is the important point, not the country of origin of the counterfeit.

Also, France may not be the hub of precision engineering it once was, but when it comes to professional cooking equipment trust me on the fact that "made in France" counts for a lot.

Also if it is easy to make high quality chef's knives for $10 why isn't the market already flooded with them? All the $10 knives I see are rubbish.
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