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Old 11-29-2007, 07:42 AM   #31
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Wysiwyg-thanks for the tip. I am very aware of Home Goods but never saw ceramic knives there! I will definately make a trip there too!

Poppinfresh-I have never (knock on wood) had a problem with my knives breaking or chipping. Sure I am careful with my knives, but I'm careful with any knife I use - right? I'm excited at the prospect of finding some ceramic knives at one of these stores!
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Old 11-29-2007, 10:33 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by buzzard767 View Post
Goodweed, I disagree (why else would I be responding?)....

Your point - progressively more difficult to sharpen etc - tell me, how many decades does it take to get to that point, and then, why not re-hollowgrind?

Did I say anything about soft "low quality" blades? Nope.

And finally, your comment that hollow ground blades "wedge" food apart. Jeeze man. Think about it. The hollow ground area of the blade never touches the medium, but your straight angled blades contact the medium the entire width of the blade, thus creating more friction and therefore, relatively inferior cutting ability. Buzz

I understand what you are saying. And in principle, it makes sense, but... When the cutting edge first meets the flesh of, say, a rutabagga, it starts to separate the flesh. As it slices deeper, it exponentially pushes he flesh apart until it reaches the flat grind part of the knife. When that happens, you are correct, only the cutting edge and the main body of the blade touch the flesh. This is another place where a problem can arize. Because of the hollow grind, the thickness of the blade at the spine is greater than it is for a straight-grind knife. It has to be to preserve knife strength as the grinding process removes more metal from the blade. This then causes the straight sides to force the flesh apart, maybe without the cutting edge ever coming into direct contact with the flesh. Hence, you are wedging the food apart rather than slicing through it.

This of course isn't true where the susbtance being cut is soft and pliable. But for hard foods such as carrots, rutabeggas, winter squash, onions, etc., it is significantly harder to drive the knife through the veggie.

To confirm this, I have used my high carbon, stain resistant, and very sharp Chicago Cutlery Chef's knive, with a hollow grind, side-by-side with my very sharp, straight-grind Croma 10-inch French Chef's knife. The Croma sliced through the tough veggies with significantly less effort than did the Chicago Cutlery.

All that aside though, I do believe that there is a place in my kitchen for ceramic knives. But I think I would get smaller knives such as for paring and detail work. I'm not sure how a ceramic fillet knife would work as it may not have the flexibility for the task. Maybe a ceramic utility knife would be a good thing as well. But those will ahve to wait for a Christmas where I have less of my paycheck helping others. Right now, I think that it's a bit too much of a luxury. My existing hodge-podge collection does the job. It'd be like me purchasing a new bow for $1200. It would be a dream-come-true, and my arrows would fly at 335 fps, but do I really need such speed to kill a hay bale? Just because it's available doesn't mean tha I need it.

Seeeeeeeya; Goodweed of the North

Seeeeeeya; Goodweed of the North
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Old 11-29-2007, 12:04 PM   #33
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Hope the below helps regarding the pros-cons of the diffrent types of zirconium ceramic blade offered..

What should I choose--a white blade or a black blade?

Both white and black blade ceramic knives are made of Zirconia. The white blades are composed of Zirconium Oxide. The black blades are Zirconium Carbide. They are made through the same manufacturing process except that the black blades are subjected to an extended final firing process that includes a precise "sintering" to produce the exotic Zirconium Carbide material. The black, Zirconium Carbide blades can be up to twice as hard as the white blades -- but both are at least 7 to 10 times as hard as the common steel knife blade.

White is the natural color of Zirconia. Manufacturers can also put white blade ceramic knives through a “carbon-infiltration” process to make the blade into black color to cater to consumers’ different preferences.
All URI Eagle black blades are Zirconium Carbide -- a far more exotic and valuable material than the Zirconium Oxide.
Zirconium Carbide is naturally black in color. One look at our Zirconium Carbide black blades and you'll be able to tell the difference between our Zirconium Carbide and the other brands' less valuable black colored Zirconium Oxide blades.
Bottom line: Our exotic Zirconium Carbide blades are priced lower than many of our competitor's blades made from Zirconium Oxide -- so now you may choose the color you like without over-paying for the Zirconium Carbide -- (if you like the black blades and want the very best make sure they are Zirconium Carbide!). They are both capable of the same long lasting sharpness and either is very durable -- both our white and black blades are covered by the same 5-year manufacturer's warranty and in-warranty sharpening service.
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Old 11-29-2007, 12:21 PM   #34
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^Again, the symbol for what these knives are made of is ZrO2 (Zirconium Dioxide). It's a small issue, but ZrO is not what we're talking about here.

The other thing I take issue with in that sales pitch they give is they are talking about the carbides (ZrC) as though they are a better option. Again, zirconium carbide is not non-reactive. There's a reason why it's primary application is in cutting tools (and I mean industrial, not kitchen). Better manufacturers have found ways to increase the durability of the knives without resorting to converting them to a carbide.


Good read on carbide:

Zirconium Carbide
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Old 12-12-2007, 02:31 PM   #35
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Sorry Poppin but you have it wrong. Look it up anywhere on the internet. Cubic Zirconia is ZrO.

zirconium oxide knives - Google Search

Shows the detail for Kyocera and Eagle ceramic knives at the very top.
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Old 12-13-2007, 03:02 PM   #36
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I've been recommending these knives for almost a year now. I bought a URI Eagle 6-inch chef's knife from Target.com last year with a Target gift card I got from my employer. I have also posted a link to a Hawaiian company that sells ceramic knives at far less than you'd pay for a Kyocera, because they're made in China instead of Japan, same as the URI Eagle. so if you have this "thing" about buying Chinese merchandise, then look somewhere else. I am old enough to remember when a stamp or sticker on an item that said MADE IN JAPAN meant it was cheap junk, so I have no problem buying Chinese manufactured goods.
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Old 12-13-2007, 03:19 PM   #37
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I ordered a Kyocera 6" Chef's knife from Cutlerandmore.com for $79.95. It should arrive tomorrow.
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Old 12-13-2007, 04:35 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by Andy M. View Post
I ordered a Kyocera 6" Chef's knife from Cutlerandmore.com for $79.95. It should arrive tomorrow.

You won't be dissappointed! Congratulations!
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Old 12-13-2007, 04:43 PM   #39
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Shenzhen Ceramic Knives, 3-Piece Chef's Set for $76.99, Includes a 6" Chef's Knife, a 4.8" Slicing Knife, and a 3.2" Paring Knife.
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Old 12-13-2007, 05:37 PM   #40
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Reviews I read on other brands indicated they were not as sharp as Kyocera.
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