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Old 01-21-2005, 06:48 PM   #21
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Paint I complely understand what you said (do not apologize) and agree that the differences in English and American makes for some misundersandings. I visit my family in Norway often and I have to remind myself to speak ENGLISH or I am having to repeat myself. The same in restaurants there, do not ask to change the menu. Sometimes when I am out here, children are screaming and parents seem deaf. I saw a couple who put their children at a separate booth within eye shot but a few booths away and proceeded to ignore their lousy behavior yelling, throwing food, taking other's food, etc. (rather like Lord of the FLies) The oldest was about 9 and the youngest was 2-3. On my way out, I walked by the table where the parents were sitting and said "I feel so sorry for those children. I am going to talk to the security guard outside to see if he can find the parents because kids that young should go out alone, don't you agree? Maybe he can find the parents." I watched from my car and the mom went to the table took the kids to sit with them.
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Old 01-21-2005, 06:50 PM   #22
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norges you have a standing ovation from me.
you are awesome
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Old 01-21-2005, 06:54 PM   #23
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norges you have a standing ovation from me.
you are awesome
Thanks.
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Old 01-21-2005, 07:22 PM   #24
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norgeskog - My son and I were sitting having something to drink at the mall and I watched a couple sit with their 3 children at the SAME table - they were running everywhere - throwing things "at" the trash can - the one holding the lid open would shut it quickly as the other was literally throwing their food in it - they were pouring their drinks on the floor and making a mess out of the drink and food that they spilled - all the while the parents just sat intently talking - probably very glad that they did not have to clean up the mess that was usually made at home. One of the workers came over and said "please stop" and the parents barely glanced over at their kids and never said a word. All of us sitting at tables around them just looked at one another in total amazement.

And the kids weren't even quiet - they were quite loud and disruptive - but like I said - they were probably glad it wasn't happening at their home for a change.
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Old 01-21-2005, 07:25 PM   #25
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norgeskog - My son and I were sitting having something to drink at the mall and I watched a couple sit with their 3 children at the SAME table - they were running everywhere - throwing .
kitchennisse, whew I thought for a minute you were going to blast me cause you were the parents I spoke to. I think that type of parenting is abusive to the children. Children want to know what is expected of them. Loving and understanding parents are better than ignoring ignorant ones.
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Old 01-21-2005, 08:21 PM   #26
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roflmao - wouldn't that be a co-inkiedinkie!!!!
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Old 01-21-2005, 08:42 PM   #27
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Well I have to agree that "gimmie ' and 'I want" do not work in my house at all........never have, never will. I was taught by my brit mom to keep elbows off the table, no chewing with my mouth open and no speaking with food in my mouth. We were sent away from the table for these infractions. When my daughter was young some of the first words she learned were "please' "thank you" and "I'm sorry" which leads into one of my more embarassing kid related resturant stories..............





We went to our local diner with her when she was about 2.5 yrs old, we were seated behind a nice older couple, who, naturally took notice of such a young cute kid. The woman offered her crackers to Monique and I said "what do you say?" .................................Monique in her tender young age says......................"I'm sorry" lordy that was embarassing!
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Old 01-21-2005, 10:41 PM   #28
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I once made a tapas party, and one brother in law liked the shrimp. He proceeded to sit down and eat ....all of it. One in law yellled, "how gross" when I took a rare roast of of the grill (intending to slice it, then cook to each person's desire). Once someone put food on my kitchen counter and fed their dog. The odd part is that I, until I left Florida, was beginning to believe I was wrong and picky or something. Once when we were in California (if I think long enough, I'll come up with where we were), a store owner made a point of saying something because my husband took off his hat when we entered the place. In the military, the only time you keep you hat on inside is if you are bearing arms. I know, most of you will think it's silly, but I do ask men to remove their hats at my table.
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Old 01-21-2005, 11:20 PM   #29
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Children do not learn without practice! When my son was young we would "put our manners on at the table" and he learned proper etiquitte for eating anywhere. I was frequently complimented on his manners when we were in public. Sometimes it helps to make a game of it but you do your children no favors if you fail to teach them good table behavior!

My parents had no education in that regard - I went to a parochial school and the nuns taught me good table manners. The one thing they didn't teach me was how to eat chicken with a knife and fork! It was always finger food at home! My mother never served chicken that wasn't fried.

The first time I had dinner at my InLaw's house of course they served chicken...what a nightmare! After that hubby taught me and my son & I learned together how to finesse the meat off a chicken breast with no fingers! For several months we had practice chicken at home.

Good manners is only the art of making those around you comfortable.

When we were out in public I would take my son into the ladies room to discipline him - (at a very young age, of course) and in a short time all I had to say to remind him to behave was "do you need to go to the restroom?" Instant compliance! To this day he claims it was because his food would have dissappeared when he returned!

As an adult I took a course in table manners - until then I considered myself well mannered - there are always things to learn!

When I go out for a nice meal I have zero tolerance for screaming babies or rude children. Take them home and teach them how to behave! DH accuses me of giving "killer" looks to the parents - guilty! He's lucky I stay at our table!
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Old 01-21-2005, 11:33 PM   #30
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Well said as always, :D 8)
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Old 01-22-2005, 02:20 AM   #31
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Thank you all so much, we thought ourselves the odd ducks.

We have found kids in restaurants are often very well mannered and have often complimented the parent(s) on their fine behavior.

But have been in restaurants where kids were running, yelling, doing everything discussed above (talking about at least moderately priced restaurants here, not McD's or other places where feral children appear to be the norm).

It has always seemed that everyone else was able to take the behavior in stride, while it was driving us crazy and ruining the dining experience.

Thanks for letting us know we are not alone.

Now that we have gotten older we try to fight back.

If we see this happening when we walk in, will tell the seater/waiter that we are leaving and why.

If it starts to happen while we are already eating, will tell the waiter we wish to be moved, yep, take our plates to another table away from the offending tykes.

If they will not, tell them this is the last meal for us at the place and ask to talk to the manager.

Wait staff does not want to deal with unruly children, actually they don't want to deal with their parents.

Once they learn they are losing money because of their unwillingless to take care of the problem, they may change their ways. Or maybe not.

Anyway, it makes us feel better.
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Old 01-22-2005, 04:20 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by norgeskog
Everyone one of us has been told to clean their plates because....I remember starving people somewhere, but other than these two I do not remember any.
China. For me it was always China.

My caretaker at the time was a lousy cook, really terrible. At age five, I remember thinking, when admonished about "the starving children in China": "Yeah, well, send them this crap. Then they won't be starving anymore."


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Old 01-22-2005, 04:22 PM   #33
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Ive found the best word to learn is "please". I learned this as a kid in Germany. Please in many countries will substitute for "excuse me", and i learned to start virtually every sentence with it. Was talking to hubby about this subject line, and obviously he agrees. Lyndaloo (I'm sure I misspelled this and will check to make sure I'm referring to the right person), a number of years ago I went to a freinds' home for dinner (a lifetime friend), and was apalled to see her son's table manners. This, the child of a French woman who my mom used to hold up as a shining example of great manners. When I lived in Germany, Mom wouldn't allow us to order chicken on the bone because at that time in Europe no one ate chicken (rabbit, whatever) with their fingers the way we did. My (French) freind would come over to our house and totally clean her chicken without ever touching it. But she still managed to raise a kid who had absolutely NO manners. I kinda get a kick here .... you go and order fried chicken or pizza, and locally the folk kind of hold down the chicken or pizza with one finger, then eat it with a fork. Once upon a time, a freind told me she was scared to go to a dining out/military ball because she was afraid her manners wouldn't pass muster. Hubby told her something that always holds true. Use the flatwear from the outside in, and always wait for someone else to start (no matter what, eating, drinking, dancing, even talking) so you can observe how those around you behave and know what is going on, and can follow. This will hold you in good stead even among follk from different countries. And, we'll agree with the whole here, you can't go wrong by taking "I" out of your conversation as much as possible.
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Old 01-22-2005, 07:25 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by Catseye
Quote:
Originally Posted by norgeskog
Everyone one of us has been told to clean their plates because....I remember starving people somewhere, but other than these two I do not remember any.
China. For me it was always China.

My caretaker at the time was a lousy cook, really terrible. At age five, I remember thinking, when admonished about "the starving children in China": "Yeah, well, send them this crap. Then they won't be starving anymore."

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Old 01-22-2005, 07:29 PM   #35
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With my post above about the unruly kids, I have also walked by parents whose children were exceptionally well behaved and told them it was a pleasure to dine where they were. ALso told the kids they should thank their parents for caring enough to teach them the proper way to behave in public. I always felt if I could b....ch about the misbehaving brats, I should also praise the ones who behave.
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Old 01-22-2005, 08:22 PM   #36
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I, too, make it a point to compliment parents for their children's good behavior in restaurants. I abhor unruly children running about and just generally being obnoxious. I remember when my youngest was about 3 1/2 and we were at a very nice restaurant on Christmas day. As we entered the dining room you could almost cut the tension with a knife. We sat down, had a lovely dinner, and-guess what-other diners came up to tell us what a lovely child we had! They oohed and aahed over her, making her giggle. It was a very enjoyable afternoon for all.
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Old 01-22-2005, 08:42 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by norgeskog
Quote:
Originally Posted by Catseye
Quote:
Originally Posted by norgeskog
Everyone one of us has been told to clean their plates because....I remember starving people somewhere, but other than these two I do not remember any.
China. For me it was always China.

My caretaker at the time was a lousy cook, really terrible. At age five, I remember thinking, when admonished about "the starving children in China": "Yeah, well, send them this crap. Then they won't be starving anymore."

Cats
Good answer Cats.
However, my dear friends, I can tell you from personal experience that it is NOT a good (or prudent) answer to give the Nun who is standing over you in grade school! I ate standing up for a week! :?
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Old 01-22-2005, 09:31 PM   #38
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The best hotel we ever stayed in had a 'nursery' where meals were served to guests children, children were not allowed in the main dining room. I loved that idea at the time......but now, having a child with a potentially fatal food allergy, I think I'd be a bit nervous about her eating under a stranger's supervision.

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Old 01-22-2005, 09:34 PM   #39
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What are "manners". I like to lick my fingers and drink my soup out of the bowl. Burping is good too. :P
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Old 01-23-2005, 07:09 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lindatooo
Quote:
Originally Posted by norgeskog
Quote:
Originally Posted by Catseye
Quote:
Originally Posted by norgeskog
Everyone one of us has been told to clean their plates because....I remember starving people somewhere, but other than these two I do not remember any.
China. For me it was always China.

My caretaker at the time was a lousy cook, really terrible. At age five, I remember thinking, when admonished about "the starving children in China": "Yeah, well, send them this crap. Then they won't be starving anymore."

Cats
Good answer Cats.
However, my dear friends, I can tell you from personal experience that it is NOT a good (or prudent) answer to give the Nun who is standing over you in grade school! I ate standing up for a week! :?
oops, guess that was not the best idea.
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