Ethics of Hunting

[buckytom]

are you a vegetarian, urmaniac?

an old girlfriend tried to freak me out by telling me to look into the eyes of the thing i was about to cook, or eat. "how can you kill such a beautiful animal". she knew i love animals, so it almost worked, until i got hungry.

after hunting and cleaning deer, turkey, and crow, and bludgeoning a pig to death (gruesome story of a pig roast that went bad), and countless fishing trips, i think i've gotten past the sympathy part.

 

[urmaniac13]

I am not exactly a vegetarian, Bucky, I must confess one of those hypocritical eaters, I do like some chicken/turkey breast, pork tenderloin, mince, bacon, speck etc, also fish, but they must be perfectly filleted so I can consider them as "a form of food", if there is anything that reminds me of its former life graphically, I immediately lose my appetite.... so I really hope you can spare me from that episode of the pig bludgeoning...

 

[Constance]

Bucky, I didn't know anyone ever actually ate crow. Isn't it kind of nasty tasting?

 

[ronjohn55]

after hunting and cleaning deer, turkey, and crow, and bludgeoning a pig to death (gruesome story of a pig roast that went bad), and countless fishing trips, i think i've gotten past the sympathy part.

I agree - I love animals too, but there comes a point where you have to just respectfully take your place at the top of the food chain. I "know" (more like know of) some hunters that go shoot a deer, and then want next to nothing to do with the processing and consumption of the meat - they just want trophy racks. Makes my blood boil.

If you are going to purposefully end the life of an animal - at least do it the service of ending it's life to provide for you and your family (Geez! I think I channeled Ted Nugent there for a minute!)


John

 

[Constance]

That's OK, Ronjon...I agree completely. My husband hunts with several other guys, some of whom enjoy the hunt, but don't eat the dear. He makes sure it gets all cleaned and packaged, and we eat it.
Some hunters around here donate their deer to the food pantry. There are several processors who will butcher it for free.

As for subbing shark and skate for scallops...I don't mind eating shark or skate, but I want to know what I'm being served.

 

[buckytom]

same here, about the swap outs of ingredients. i would have no problem eating skate fra diavolo, or shark in butter,lemon and herbs, so long as that was what i was expecting, and paying (less) for.

constance, eating crows is kinda nasty, but we went hunting for them to protect a corn field, and for fun (hey, i was very young), and all of us were adamant about not wasting an animal for sport, so we bbq'd them to make them edible.

 

[Chief Longwind Of The North]

It is believed by many, myself included, that all life has a purpose, and that when any life, be it plant or animal, is taken, it is taken with respect and only as much as is needful. And I am also of the mind that if a person takes on the responsibility of owning a pet, that the pet must be cared for with respect and love for the animal. After all, though the intellect may not be that of a grown himan, it is still an intellect, capable of feelings, and desires. And I know for a fact, that the only things my dog desires are some loving attention, food, and a chance to get outside to relieve herself. If a person mistreats any life, then in some way, at some time, he/she will answer for it.

That said, I am not a vegitarian, I have hunted, and will do so again. I have fished and will again. I have butchered a few chickens in my time. But I have and never will kill for sport, or for a trophy, only to feed myself and my family.

Seeeeya; Goodweed of the North

 

[DampCharcoal]

Goodweed, my friend, I have to disagree with you on this one. If I had my way, it would be open season on deer all year long. They are a menace and they cause many fatal accidents year after year. Don't get me wrong, I'm an animal lover too and deer are beautiful creatures but they procreate at an amazing rate and there are WAY too many of them. The most common cause of automobile deaths involving deer around here is when a deer is struck and the body rolls over the hood, crashing through the windshield. Whether they are taken for food or not, they need to be shot on sight.

 

[Chief Longwind Of The North]

That is true of deer in some areas. But the offending animal is the North American White Tailed Deer. It is highly adaptive and ranges from Forida to California, to Washington State, and back to Main. They are also found in most parts of Canada. The mule deer, on the other hand, is an endangered species in much of its native range. It is hurt by loss of habitat, and by inter-breeding with white-tailed deer. The inter-breeding deprives the fawns of instinctive protective behavior. The two species have drastically different ways of protecting themselves from predation. When the species interbreed, the mule deer fawn simply loses its natural instinct to run. It stays put, like the odorless and well camoflaged white tail fawn. But it isn't odorless, and doesn't know how to hide itself from predators. So it becomes easy prey.

But remember, any species that over populates an area becomes a nuiscance, even a menace. Some fool though rabbits would be a good transplant into Australia. We have a few Aussies in this group who could probably tell you what a problem they are (the bunnies, not the Aussies).

And I think that we, as animals on this planet, are too successful for our own good as well. In all of Earth's history, whether you are religeous or not, whenever a species has become dominant, and threatened the natural ballance, something catastrophic has occured to knock down that population, even destroy it. I worry about the human animal. We are truly an unballancing force upon this planet.

Seeeeeya; Goodweed of the North

 

[buckytom]

And I know for a fact, that the only things my dog desires are some loving attention, food, and a chance to get outside to relieve herself.

you have obviously had your dog "fixed"...

 

[Chief Longwind Of The North]

you have obviously had your dog "fixed"...

you have obviously had your dog "fixed"...

Yup. Though we love her, I wouldn't want any more like her. She can be such a pain. When she was just a bit younger, she would run accross the livingroom, leap into the air and use whoever was handy as a springboard to launch herself in the opposite direction. And let me tell you, a 35 to 40 lb. dog traveling at however fast she can run can transfer considerable energy to your belly when she hit you. And don't even get me started about how much noise she makes whenever someone comes to our door, or we go outside to work in the yard without taking her along.

She's sometimes made me wonder how she'd taste in a stew.

But seriously, there are many reasons to hunt, and many reasons not to hunt. It isn't a required survival skill in our current society. And yet, just as with gardening, it is a valuable skill. I can see how national and global circustances would make hunting for survival a required skill. Our way of life is often more fragile than we think. And I do know of families that were very poor, for one reason or another, who lived off of hunting and gathering skills. They ate foods that could be gathered from the wild, and hunted.

I just couldn't bring myself to trophy hunt. I'm kind of a non-vilolent type. It pains me just a bit to watch a life taken, even a Christmas Tree. And yet, I used to go out in the woods and cut them with my family, and will again if I ever have grandchildren. I just keep the sadness to myself. And I don't know if the tree really has any sentience. And I still want meat with my sweet potatoes thank you.

Seeeeeya; Goodweed of the North

 

[Constance]

I don't know how to say this without sounding nuttier than I am, but I think of trees as living "beings". I have 200 foot oak trees surrounding my house, as well as an ancient dogwood and an old sassafras that you can't even reach around. They've been here so long, and seen so much, bending in the wind instead of breaking, standing guard on this little piece of land...I feel they have spirits of their own.

 

[GB]

That does not sound nutty at all Constance. They ARE alive after all. Sure they might not have a central nervous system, but none of us can claim to really know what it is like to be a tree

I have no problem with people who hunt for food. Humans are at the top of the food chain and are omnivours. Some people make a choice to be vegetarian (and I have no problem with that of course), but we are really omnivourus. As long as people hunt for food then I feel that is just part of the life cycle of animals. Personally I don't think I would ever be able to pick up a gun and shoot something, but that is just me. I have fished and have no problem doing that. I guess I could be considered a hypocrite because I have no problem killing insects.

 

[buckytom]

I don't know how to say this without sounding nuttier than I am, but I think of trees as living "beings". I have 200 foot oak trees surrounding my house, as well as an ancient dogwood and an old sassafras that you can't even reach around. They've been here so long, and seen so much, bending in the wind instead of breaking, standing guard on this little piece of land...I feel they have spirits of their own.

constance, that's not nutty at all. did you know that the tradition of knocking on wood supposedly dates back to the druids? it was to call up the spirits of the wood for luck and protection.

knowing my luck, i would knock on the wood, and end up getting a whiny druish princess...

 

[Alix]

GROOOOAN! Buckytom that was BAAAD!

 

[ronjohn55]

knowing my luck, i would knock on the wood, and end up getting a whiny druish princess...

"SPACE BALLS, the Flamethrower! <The kids LOVE this one!>"

And of course, my favorite line from that film..

"They've gone to plaid! They must have overshot us by a week!"

John

 

[Alix]

"I see your schwartz is as big as mine..." I'd better stop there, this could take us SERIOUSLY off topic. BTW, big favourite here too! Kids just discovered Spaceballs and loved it. And now, back to our topic of the Ethics of hunting...(sorry about the hijack!)

 

[ronjohn55]

And now, back to our topic of the Ethics of hunting...(sorry about the hijack!)

Hmm, would using a flamethrower for hunting be ethical? I mean, think of the time savings when it comes to grilling!

John

 

[buckytom]

all kidding aside, burning the hair off a beastie before you cook is a very efficient way of eliminating it. otherwise, you'd have to boil the animal to get rid of the hair. with a 100 lb pig, that ain't easy. where do you get a pot of boiling water big enough to fit the whole carcass?
we actually used a beard trimmer one year...

 

[Alix]

A beard trimmer...you did not. You're messing with me now. That would take FOREVER.