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Old 10-16-2008, 09:41 PM   #41
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I understand what you are trying to do here, cg, but you are talking two different cooking methods.
I personally do not see why people try to duplicate one cooking method to another.
A grilled porch chop comes out differently than a fried one. I love them both, but I do not try to make the two methods meet in the middle. When I am in the mood for either that's what I cook.

I think you need to maybe work on your grilling techniques a little, but realize that if you really love the way your ribs come out in the oven, you will never duplicate that same rib on the grill. And why bother really? It's an entirely different cooking process and the results are also different. You seem to be trying to duplicate the finished product, but the methods are different, so the results will never be exactly the same.

IMO
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Old 10-17-2008, 07:30 AM   #42
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Pacanis, it's all "indirect cooking" just using different forms of heat. Whether it's a grill, smoker, oven or campfire it's low and slow. In reality, you're turning whatever piece of equipment you are using into an oven. You can indirect cook ribs on a grill and use wood chip packets to achieve very simillar results as a smoker.....without using a smoker. I cook whole, un-butterflied chickens on my grill the same way - 2 outside burners on and the one directly under the meat off.

He's on the right track by lowering the cooking temps. I never felt the absolute need for a water tray since I baste every 30 minutes and achieve very tender ribs. Either way is fine. You really need to know your grill though.

Situations like this usually drive people to invent. I'm curious how the results come out.
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Old 10-17-2008, 08:35 AM   #43
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Pacanis, it's all "indirect cooking" just using different forms of heat. Whether it's a grill, smoker, oven or campfire it's low and slow. In reality, you're turning whatever piece of equipment you are using into an oven. You can indirect cook ribs on a grill and use wood chip packets to achieve very simillar results as a smoker.....without using a smoker. I cook whole, un-butterflied chickens on my grill the same way - 2 outside burners on and the one directly under the meat off.

He's on the right track by lowering the cooking temps. I never felt the absolute need for a water tray since I baste every 30 minutes and achieve very tender ribs. Either way is fine. You really need to know your grill though.

Situations like this usually drive people to invent. I'm curious how the results come out.
I was thinking the same thing...I have cooked ribs, whole chickens, pork loins and cobblers on my grill...it works just like an oven.
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Old 10-17-2008, 08:43 AM   #44
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I was thinking the same thing...I have cooked ribs, whole chickens, pork loins and cobblers on my grill...it works just like an oven.
How about a potato gratin in a dutch oven....on the grill?

The oven had a turkey in it. lol
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Old 10-17-2008, 08:56 AM   #45
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I always considered grills to be "drier" than ovens and with a lot more airflow. Unless you have an electric oven. You typically cooking on a grate instead of a cooking vessel, you're close to the heat source.... It's just a different animal. Ovens, IMO, are much more forgiving.

And shouldn't we really be working towards turning our ovens into grills, instead of the other way around?
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Old 10-17-2008, 09:03 AM   #46
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There's grates in the oven too. lol
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Old 10-19-2008, 03:21 PM   #47
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I understand what you are trying to do here, cg, but you are talking two different cooking methods.
I personally do not see why people try to duplicate one cooking method to another.
A grilled porch chop comes out differently than a fried one. I love them both, but I do not try to make the two methods meet in the middle. When I am in the mood for either that's what I cook.

I think you need to maybe work on your grilling techniques a little, but realize that if you really love the way your ribs come out in the oven, you will never duplicate that same rib on the grill. And why bother really? It's an entirely different cooking process and the results are also different. You seem to be trying to duplicate the finished product, but the methods are different, so the results will never be exactly the same.

IMO
You make a good point but I don't entirely agree. I obviously can't add smoke to the ribs when I cook them in the oven and during the summer months I'd prefer to cook outside and not have my oven on for 3 hours heating up my house.

I cook steaks in the oven and on the grill and there is no comparison. The grilled steaks are 10x better. Same for chicken, fish just about everything. This is the first time I've ever cooked anything in the oven that I preferred to the grilled equivalent.

In the end I would like to enjoy moist, tender ribs on either the grill or from the oven. I think I've figured out the oven method but my grill technique needs work (as you say). The smoke seems like it might be drying them out somewhat. I baste too every 30 minutes.

Adding a water pan is tricky because there isn't much clearance between the flavor bars and the cooking grates. Still I think it is worth a try. Others have said they wrap their ribs in foil part way through the cooking time. I suppose I could try this too but it would prevent the smoke.

Trial and error, practice makes perfect.
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Old 10-19-2008, 03:47 PM   #48
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hi, my first post here but ive had some great succss with ribs, first, your tem is too low keep it at 220, next, rub you ribs overnight and let them come to room temp befor cooking, next, smoke at 220 for 2.5 to 3 hrs spritzing with apple juice and rum (if desired) a few times, next, pull from the grill and wrap in hd foil with a last spritz and return to the heat for 2 hrs, next, remove from foil and return to grill to firm up and add sause if desired, trust me, i came from the smokin meat forum
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Old 10-19-2008, 04:21 PM   #49
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I'm a competition cook and have a catering company here is how I would handle ribs.

The cook is broken into 3 parts, first I smoke the ribs for aprox 3 hours. What I look for is color and pull back on the bone. When I get about 1/2" of pull back and good color I will put the ribs in foil along with honey, some raw sugar, a little hot sauce or cayenne pepper and fruit juice (your call apple, pineapple what ever you like). Then the they go into the cooker, the time in foil will give the tenderness you want. The longer in foil the more you will have falling off the bone. Because of the pit temps I use 260 to 275 for ribs I cook in foil for only about 45 min to 1 hour ( I like them tender, bite clean off the bone but not falling off). Then you remove from foil glaze go back on grill just long enough to set the glaze.

Moisture in the cooker does equate to moist ribs, cooking long enough to break down connective tissue without over cooking is the key. To tell if they done you can take a toothpick and slide it into the meat between bones, if it feels like it is going into room temp butter they are done.

Spares take 1 1/2 to 2 hours longer than babybacks.
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Old 10-19-2008, 07:55 PM   #50
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hi, my first post here but ive had some great succss with ribs, first, your tem is too low keep it at 220, next, rub you ribs overnight and let them come to room temp befor cooking, next, smoke at 220 for 2.5 to 3 hrs spritzing with apple juice and rum (if desired) a few times, next, pull from the grill and wrap in hd foil with a last spritz and return to the heat for 2 hrs, next, remove from foil and return to grill to firm up and add sause if desired, trust me, i came from the smokin meat forum
The ribs I'm using are baby backs and on the smallish side. If I cook them for longer than 3 hours they will be dried out and tough (I've tried). Since I'm using a grill not a smoker I think I need to add moisture (in addition to basting/spritzing) and maybe knock the temp down to 225 instead of 250. Wrapping in foil may be an option for the second hour so I can at least get the first hour with smoke.

Thanks everyone for all the suggestions. I wish it was May and not October. Tough to grill in CT in the fall/winter.
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Old 10-20-2008, 08:36 AM   #51
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Dry ribs means the temp is too high. Over cooked at 225 means mushy meat, not dry.
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Old 10-20-2008, 09:40 AM   #52
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There's grates in the oven too. lol
That's an interesting point.
I suppose you could lay the ribs directly on the oven grates
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Old 10-20-2008, 09:50 AM   #53
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You make a good point but I don't entirely agree. I obviously can't add smoke to the ribs when I cook them in the oven and during the summer months I'd prefer to cook outside and not have my oven on for 3 hours heating up my house.

Have you tried adding a pie tin of water and liquid smoke? Cheating, but it works

I cook steaks in the oven and on the grill and there is no comparison. The grilled steaks are 10x better. Same for chicken, fish just about everything. This is the first time I've ever cooked anything in the oven that I preferred to the grilled equivalent.

I think there is no comparison, too, but there are many here who favor a pan seared/stick in the oven steak. I'd just as soon throw mine on teh grill like you.

In the end I would like to enjoy moist, tender ribs on either the grill or from the oven. I think I've figured out the oven method but my grill technique needs work (as you say). The smoke seems like it might be drying them out somewhat. I baste too every 30 minutes.

Follow jminion's advice. I've done them this way and they are definitely moist, but they are still different than oven cooked.

Adding a water pan is tricky because there isn't much clearance between the flavor bars and the cooking grates. Still I think it is worth a try. Others have said they wrap their ribs in foil part way through the cooking time. I suppose I could try this too but it would prevent the smoke.

Again, refer to jminion's post. They pick up the smoke in the beginning, before you wrap them. And from what I've read on the "smoke" forums, after the meat reaches 140 it's about as smoked as it's going to get.

Trial and error, practice makes perfect.
I'm with ya there! I'm trying to figure out a Weber smoker, or "pit" as they're called

oops, looks like I need to figure out that muliple quote thing.
I'm in red (obviously)
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Old 10-20-2008, 01:06 PM   #54
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pacanis
Here is an explaination of a fireup method for a Weber Smokey Mountain cooker
Firing Up Your Weber Bullet - The Virtual Weber Bullet

With the new formual Kingsford (if that is what you are using) start out with fewer lit coals than is used in fireup explained in the link above.

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Old 10-20-2008, 01:51 PM   #55
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Thanks Jim.
I was going to use that method (been all over that site), but someone on another forum tweaked it a bit and I followed how he fires up his WSM. I think it was a charcoal problem, Wicked Good lump brand. I just looked in and there's a bunch that I added later not ignited and it looks like the other stuff just stopped burning.... How does that happen with vents open.... lousy stuff.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled thread (lol)
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Old 10-20-2008, 08:42 PM   #56
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Wicked good is good charcoal, it may have been that there was very little fire left and it did not lite the charcoal you added.
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Old 10-21-2008, 05:52 AM   #57
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It is? Maybe I need to practice with charcoal first, something a lot more uniform. It certainly lit quickly, I'll give it that.
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Old 10-21-2008, 08:31 AM   #58
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It is? Maybe I need to practice with charcoal first, something a lot more uniform. It certainly lit quickly, I'll give it that.
Briquettes should be started seperately in a chimney before adding them to the cooker. You can throw lump directly on the fire inside the cooker but it needs to still be somewhat hot. Otherwise it won't catch.
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Old 10-21-2008, 09:19 AM   #59
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Dry ribs means the temp is too high. Over cooked at 225 means mushy meat, not dry.
That's interesting, so overcooking at a lower temp is different than over cooked at a higher temp.

I cook ribs at 260 to 275 and if they get over cooked it just happens sooner than if I cooked at 225 but they would still be over cooked.
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Old 10-21-2008, 09:26 AM   #60
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Briquettes should be started seperately in a chimney before adding them to the cooker. You can throw lump directly on the fire inside the cooker but it needs to still be somewhat hot. Otherwise it won't catch.
There's this method called the minion method where you have unlit charcoal in the ring. The lit chimney full you dump in and spread around is supposed to ignite the unlit, thereby giving you a longer burn time without having to add anything. From what I've "read", it works with either lump or briquettes. And it seemed to work for me, it just did not give me the length ot burn time I was expecting.
Granted, this is all just "book learning" at this stage of the game
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