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Old 12-04-2014, 02:40 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CharlieD View Post
pardon my ignorance, but if you use pastry flour, aren't you going to end up with pastry dough?
Not an expert on flours, CharlieD, but from what I've gathered in reading various chapters of the book I've mentioned, pastry flour is a lower in gluten flour than bread flour and higher in gluten than cake flour and is "used for cookies, pie pastry, and some sweet yeast doughs, and for biscuits and muffins."

Like most people, I grew up using AP flour, whole wheat flour, graham flour, or rye flour (and wild rice flour, but that is probably not what most folks grew up using). I don't know that I've ever used pastry flour...and my pie crusts turn out pretty flaky and tender, even before I started adding vinegar and vodka. I'm intrigued by using the baker's percentage with my grandma's recipe and then trying it using pastry flour and then trying it using whole wheat flour (since I do make ww flour crusts for various savory tarts). Baking is all about chemistry and I'm now trying to understand why and how the various ingredients work/don't work together. This from a person who likes to cook without recipes...

This book also recommends that the salt be added to the water, not mixed in with the flour as most of us were probably taught to do.

As you might have guessed, I've had a pretty quiet week and have been reading different chapters of this book off and on.
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Old 12-04-2014, 08:48 PM   #22
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I always dissolve salt in water before mixing flour and water.


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Old 12-04-2014, 09:40 PM   #23
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I always dissolve salt in water before mixing flour and water.


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Have you noticed this makes a difference? Just got off the phone with a friend from the Czech Republic. She hates that NA recipes are not given in weights. That's how she grew up cooking and she has a really hard time using NA recipes. She's excited to come over and play with trying to turn my grandma's pie crust recipe into "baker's math" measurements. We'll see how this works.
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Old 12-07-2014, 07:47 PM   #24
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Foot sure.


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Old 12-08-2014, 03:38 PM   #25
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Andy, I think you've likely had your question answered but I'm chiming in too. My standard recipe is:

2 cups flour
2/3 cup lard/shortening
5 tbsps (75ml) ice water
1 tbsp vinegar or vodka


Andy, that last tbsp of vinegar/vodka seems to do the trick in terms of a nicer edge on the pie crust.

When I split the dough, I use a bit more for the bottom than for the top.

Last tip, plunge your hands in icy water before working the dough. It will help you keep a flakier crust.
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Old 12-08-2014, 04:53 PM   #26
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Andy, I think you've likely had your question answered but I'm chiming in too. My standard recipe is:

2 cups flour
2/3 cup lard/shortening
5 tbsps (75ml) ice water
1 tbsp vinegar or vodka


Andy, that last tbsp of vinegar/vodka seems to do the trick in terms of a nicer edge on the pie crust.

When I split the dough, I use a bit more for the bottom than for the top.

Last tip, plunge your hands in icy water before working the dough. It will help you keep a flakier crust.

Thanks, Alix. The vodka seems to be the secret to the solution of my dilemma.
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Old 11-25-2015, 07:59 PM   #27
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Pie Crusts

I'mm new here but I just discovered the most amazing pie crust recipe. I used Crisco for years and then read the label one day and realized it was mostly all soy so I stopped using it. I started using coconut oil instead. I made my first pie crust with this recipe today and it is great.

1 and 1/2 cups of flour
1/2 cup coconut oil
1 tablespoon sugar
1/2 teaspoon salt
5-7 tablespoons cold water

Mix all dry ingredients together. Cut in coconut oil. Add water a tablespoon at a time. Make into a ball, wrap in plastic wrap and put in the fridge for 60 minutes (you can't skip this step). Roll out and fill.

This makes one pie crust for a 9" pie. I doubled the recipe for a double crust pie.
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Old 11-26-2015, 03:08 AM   #28
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More water will help make it roll out better. I often make the dough to the point where it clumps when squeezed like all the recipes tell you to. Then I add enough vodka to make a nice soft dough. I learned this trick from America's test kitchen.
I do remember Chis mentioning that there was no need for dough to be almost bone dry. He did a demo of the dry pastry and sure enough he had the same problem as everyone else does. But when he did the second crust with more water, the dough rolled out so easy it was like magic.
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Old 11-26-2015, 09:02 AM   #29
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I do remember Chis mentioning that there was no need for dough to be almost bone dry. He did a demo of the dry pastry and sure enough he had the same problem as everyone else does. But when he did the second crust with more water, the dough rolled out so easy it was like magic.
Over the years I've decided to ignore all of the TV cooks who insist on dry pie dough and just add enough water to make a nice, easy to roll out dough. It still comes out tender and flaky. Sometimes I still use vodka but most of the time I don't.

I'm very suspicious when they demonstrate mixing the dry dough, then take a disk out to roll, somehow magically it doesn't split around the edges, but rolls out nice and round. I'm pretty sure that there is more liquid in that dough to make it pretty for the camera.
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Old 11-26-2015, 09:27 AM   #30
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Over the years I've decided to ignore all of the TV cooks who insist on dry pie dough and just add enough water to make a nice, easy to roll out dough. It still comes out tender and flaky. Sometimes I still use vodka but most of the time I don't.

I'm very suspicious when they demonstrate mixing the dry dough, then take a disk out to roll, somehow magically it doesn't split around the edges, but rolls out nice and round. I'm pretty sure that there is more liquid in that dough to make it pretty for the camera.
Gee, I thought I was the only one who thought that. Somewhere there is a Foo Stylist in the background.

I have often thought that the TV cooks live in another world. Have any of them ever cooked a meal with kids underfoot in a kitchen that leaves a lot to be desired? And they seem to have boundless counter space.
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Old 11-27-2015, 06:45 AM   #31
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I'm sorry. I was so excited about that pie crust that I didn't put in when to put in the coconut oil. You cut it in after you mix all the dry ingredients together.

I could have rolled mine a little thinner but everybody said it was good so this will be my new go too pie crust.
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Old 11-27-2015, 12:32 PM   #32
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I'm sorry. I was so excited about that pie crust that I didn't put in when to put in the coconut oil. You cut it in after you mix all the dry ingredients together.

I could have rolled mine a little thinner but everybody said it was good so this will be my new go too pie crust.
No apology needed. I thought that was when you would add it but we get new cooks everyday.
I am sure a mod will now fix your post.
Hey it could be worse, you could have forgotten both flour and sugar when posting a banana bread recipe. I did that last week.
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Old 11-27-2015, 12:34 PM   #33
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Post has been fixed.
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Old 11-27-2015, 12:39 PM   #34
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Post has been fixed.
Thanks, Dawg! ☺
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Old 11-29-2015, 09:36 AM   #35
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My wife's mother's mother's owned a hotel/resturant in the fifties. "Riverside Lodge'.
At the time the pastry cook was an old lady who had worked at the lodge for many years.
The old lady gave her pie crust recipe to my wife's grandmother. Grandmother handed it down to her daughter and her daughter gave the recipe to my wife.
This recipe makes the very best pie crusts I and everyone who tries it thinks is the best they have ever eaten.
Here's the recipe. Obviously it must be carefully followed: 5Cups All purpose Flour
1 lb of unsalted butter
1 whole egg
1 T plain white vinegar
Enough really cold water to measure up to 1 cup after the whole egg (don't beat the egg) and the vinegar have been added to the measuring cup.
A pinch of Kosher salt and a pinch of sugar
Keep liquid cool while you 'cut in' the cold butter into the flour until the butter is about the size of small peas.
Make a well with the flour/salt/sugar mixed together
Pour ALL the liquid into the well at once
Mix well with a fork
Make a ball
Wrap tightly in plastic wrap
Refrigerate for an hour at least
Then roll out to form the pie crusts
This recipe makes about 3 double crusts depending on how thin you roll them out.
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Old 11-30-2015, 01:02 AM   #36
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Hi Puffin
Thanks for posting the pie Crust recipe.


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Old 11-30-2015, 08:28 AM   #37
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Hi Puffin
Thanks for posting the pie Crust recipe.


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You're most welcome.
My wife made an 'issai' kiwi and blueberry pie yesterday using the recipe.
Just delicious!
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Old 11-30-2015, 09:58 AM   #38
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The recipe submitted by puffin3 sounds very similar to a recipe given to me by an elderly neighbor more than 30 years ago. Great recipe for pie crust!! The vinegar really breaks the egg down.
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Old 06-19-2016, 04:01 PM   #39
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OK you are all doing it wrong. First of all, a tablespoon of vodka? Not nearly enough. I start out with a large glass of vodka, preferably ice cold.

So drink the vodka (helps if you know a couple Russian drinking songs) and while you are doing so gather this stuff.

2 cups flour (8.5 oz) (I'm not that picky, I normally have both whole wheat and bread flour around, I tend to use half and half)
5/8 cup salted butter, should be refrigerator soft
1/2 tsp salt
1/2 cup whole milk
2 large eggs
1 egg yolk for glaze

So I start off by creaming the flour, butter and salt together. Which for me means dumping them in a bowl, and taking two butter knives and slashing them side to side like a serial killer (This is also an excellent time for Russian drinking songs). When it looks kind of pearly, beat the eggs and add with the milk. Form into a dough ball. Chill that in the fridge for a half hour, or how long it takes to drink another glass of vodka.

At this point it should roll out nicely into a round with a little coaxing on a floured baking mat. If it for some reason it doesn't, pour a third glass of vodka, make a cobbler, and pretend that was what you were up to in the first place.

Cheers,

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Old 06-19-2016, 04:33 PM   #40
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I have a simple dough recipe I use (requires neither vodka nor Russian drinking songs - don't know if that's good or bad). I got this from Allrecipes.com:

4 oz cream cheese, softened

1/2 cup butter, softened

1 cup flour

Blend cream cheese and butter or margarine. Stir in flour just until blended. Chill about 1 hour. This can be made ahead and chilled for up to 24 hours.

Preheat oven to 325 degrees F (165 degrees C).

Shape dough into 24 one-inch balls and press into ungreased 1 1/2 inch muffin cups (mini-muffin size) to make a shallow shell. Fill with your favorite filling and bake for 20 minutes, or until the crust is light brown.

This is for tart shells. You can double the recipe for a one crust pie.

I don't usually make pie crusts. I can never get them to roll out without the dough sticking to the rolling pin. I don't care how much flour I put on the crust or the pin, when I lift the pin, half the dough comes up with it. Not to mention that when I roll, pieces of dough come up sticking to the rolling pin and leave holes to be patched in the dough. My pie crusts end up looking like a street with a million fixed and unfixed potholes.

So I've pretty much given up on that. I buy pie crusts from the store now unless I make the dough above for tarts. Those I just press into a muffin pan by hand.

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Pie Crusts [FONT=Verdana][SIZE=3]I really don't like making pie crusts. Probably because it's a struggle to get them to come out right. But the are really better than the pre-made stuff so it's worth the effort. I use an Alton Brown recipe. Here are the ingredients for one crust. [B]One Crust:[/B] 3 Oz Butter, chilled 1 Oz Shortening, chilled 6 Oz AP Flour, plus extra for dusting ½ tsp Table Salt ¼ C Ice Water [/SIZE][/FONT][FONT=Arial][FONT=Verdana][SIZE=3] The preparation is fairly standard in a food processor.[/SIZE][/FONT][FONT=Verdana][SIZE=3] For as long as I can remember, recipes have a caution to use the smallest amount of water that results in the dough sticking together when compressed. I do this and wrap and chill a disk of dough (or two). When I roll it out, the edges split to weird shapes like the profile of a mountain range. I have to do a lot of patching/mending to get a decent edge. I know if I buy prepared pie crusts, this doesn't happen. What do I do? Add more water? change the amounts or ingredients? Also, When making two crusts, do you separate the dough into two equal parts or allocate more than half to the top crust for something like an apple pie that can be fairly tall? I made an apple pie for Thanksgiving and it was really good but I did have the issue rolling out the dough. I used a deep dish dark glass pie plate and baked it at the bottom of the oven so the bottom crust would cook.[/SIZE][/FONT] [/FONT] 3 stars 1 reviews
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