Addie
Chef Extraordinaire
And most often with good reason.
Is it just me...
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If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
And most often with good reason.
CharlieD
Chef Extraordinaire
Obviously taste is a personal preference and I will never going to argue with anybody about taste.
But few years ago I was introduced to free range, pasture grass fed beef. I found the taste so much more pleasant, so much more flavorful compared to corn fed cows. Absolutely no comparing. I now only search for grass fed meat. To the point that I try to avoid meat produced from corn fed animals. Same goes with chicken.
But few years ago I was introduced to free range, pasture grass fed beef. I found the taste so much more pleasant, so much more flavorful compared to corn fed cows. Absolutely no comparing. I now only search for grass fed meat. To the point that I try to avoid meat produced from corn fed animals. Same goes with chicken.
GotGarlic
Chef Extraordinaire
I did the same thing several years ago and had the opposite experience. The grass-fed beef didn't seem to have much flavor. Grade, aging and proper cooking seem to affect flavor much more, imo.
Addie
Chef Extraordinaire
One day I was watching a piece regarding how our food is made. I already knew that corn was not on the menu for cattle. They are grazers. When they are rounded up off the range and loaded to be shipped to the feed lots. Corn IS NOT a natural food for them. They only are fed it to fatten them up quickly and then shipped off to slaughter.
For the first or couple of days they spend in the feed lots, they refuse to eat. It is only when they become starving, will they wander over to the troughs that have the kernels of corn in them.
And BTW, there is a world of difference between the corn that is sold to the public for eating and what is grown and fed to cattle for fattening. Even humans wouldn't eat what they are given.
For the first or couple of days they spend in the feed lots, they refuse to eat. It is only when they become starving, will they wander over to the troughs that have the kernels of corn in them.
And BTW, there is a world of difference between the corn that is sold to the public for eating and what is grown and fed to cattle for fattening. Even humans wouldn't eat what they are given.
GotGarlic
Chef Extraordinaire
It's been bugging me that this misinformation has been sitting here unanswered, sooo...
There are a lot of "documentaries" out there these days that are just propaganda and are are as unreliable as some nutrition sites. Be careful what you believe.
It's not true at all that cattle won't eat corn unless they're starving, nor is true that they get only corn in a feedlot, nor is it true that they get corn kernels. Producing cattle feed is a precise science. People seem to think that corn-fed cattle are raised for their entire lives on corn, but that's not the case.
https://beefrunner.com/2012/09/27/ask-a-farmer-does-feeding-corn-harm-cattle/
Of course there is a difference. Their digestive systems, including four stomachs, process grass and other forage differently from ours - they very efficiently turn carbs into protein. So they're putting on weight in a feedlot, but it's not fat.
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skilletlicker
Head Chef
Not to be argumentative, but ...
Corn on the cob from the produce department, canned corn, and frozen corn is all sweet corn too.
But Americans eat a lot of dent corn. Cornbread, corn chips, and corn syrup, high fructose or not, are all made of dent corn.
There is another kind called Indian corn or flint corn. I only see it in the big chain grocery stores in the fall sold dried on the cob mainly for decoration. White, yellow, red, and blue flint corn kernels are often sold in bulk in ethnic Mexican grocery stores though. That's the kind of corn that hominy is made from as well as the traditional masa from which corn tortillas are made. I'm not sure whether dent or flint corn is actually used in mass-produced corn tortillas most common in grocery stores.
Anyway, not to be argumentative, but I'd guess that Americans who do most of their shopping in those center aisles of the grocery store and generally prefer processed foods to vegetables are probably eating more dent/field corn than sweet corn.
Livestock is fed dent corn, also known as field corn, and there is a big difference between dent corn and sweet corn.GotGarlic said:
Corn on the cob from the produce department, canned corn, and frozen corn is all sweet corn too.
But Americans eat a lot of dent corn. Cornbread, corn chips, and corn syrup, high fructose or not, are all made of dent corn.
There is another kind called Indian corn or flint corn. I only see it in the big chain grocery stores in the fall sold dried on the cob mainly for decoration. White, yellow, red, and blue flint corn kernels are often sold in bulk in ethnic Mexican grocery stores though. That's the kind of corn that hominy is made from as well as the traditional masa from which corn tortillas are made. I'm not sure whether dent or flint corn is actually used in mass-produced corn tortillas most common in grocery stores.
Anyway, not to be argumentative, but I'd guess that Americans who do most of their shopping in those center aisles of the grocery store and generally prefer processed foods to vegetables are probably eating more dent/field corn than sweet corn.
In the North of England, and in Scotland, sheep seem to be everywhere. Yet, in all the times I've been there, I don't recall eating any lamb. I did buy an absolutely wonderful soft cashmere sweater in Scotland.
The UK has always seemed rather pork-centric, from my personal experience. I've never been there for more than couple of weeks at a time, so I don't know what they eat on a daily basis.
CD
In several polls, Americans preferred corn finished beef to grass finished. I prefer grass finished beef, and a lot of that has to do with the fact that I have been to a couple of Texas feed lots. The animals live in mud and feces, and eat corn, which cattle were not designed to eat.
Keep in mind, all cattle start out grass fed. They get sent to feed lots to eat corn and gain weight when they are close to slaughter age. So, "grass fed" doesn't mean that all the cattle ate was grass, unless the rancher specifically says so. Nolan Ryan says, point blank, "Cattle raised exclusively on a grass diet, never receiving any grain."
I love a good steak. But, I also want to know that the animal who died for my dinner had a decent, humane life.
CD
Well, once again, in your compulsion to correct Addie, you got it all wrong.
Cattle feedlots are horrible places. You can post links to websites that support your arguments, but I've actually been to some. Real life experience. The cattle are living in mud and feces. They get pumped full of antibiotics just to keep them alive long enough to gain weight, so the owners can get more money from them. And yes, it is almost all fat!
I wish I could take you to one. The stench is overwhelming. Imagine an outhouse in July, that has never been cleaned. Then, double that.
The cattle eat corn, which they were not meant to eat, because that is what is available to them. Again, it is all about fattening them up.
We have a lot of corporate chicken farms here in NE Texas, too. I can't describe the smell from those. Imagine an outhouse full of s--t and ammonia. Double that. You can drive past one by 500 yards, and have to roll up the car windows.
CD
Addie
Chef Extraordinaire
Thank you CD. When I was living in Texas, my daughter was dating a boy whose family owned a large cattle range in the middle of Texas. I was fortunate enough that they invited me there a number of times and it was definitely an eye opener regarding how we get our food. I think the most difficult activity was during branding time. But I got over it quickly. The cattle would let out a howl get it's ear either clipped or tagged and a few other activities done and be on his way.
I was always full of questions. Regarding branding; "Why. There isn't any more cattle rustling?" Oh how wrong that statement was. Then I was invited there when it came roundup time. Followed the cattle to the feed lots. I experienced the same as you. Now due to surgery as a newborn infant, my sense of smell is almost nonexistent. But I could smell that feed lot. The workers were also loading up a herd for slaughter. When those stalls were empty, the troughs were filled with the corn, and then my hosts trucks were emptied without even cleaning up the ground of the feces from the last herd. I was horrified, but kept my mouth shut. What did I know. I was just a Yankee from up north.
Even with the western style hankerchief that my host gave me to place over my nose, it was exactly as you described.
I was always full of questions. Regarding branding; "Why. There isn't any more cattle rustling?" Oh how wrong that statement was. Then I was invited there when it came roundup time. Followed the cattle to the feed lots. I experienced the same as you. Now due to surgery as a newborn infant, my sense of smell is almost nonexistent. But I could smell that feed lot. The workers were also loading up a herd for slaughter. When those stalls were empty, the troughs were filled with the corn, and then my hosts trucks were emptied without even cleaning up the ground of the feces from the last herd. I was horrified, but kept my mouth shut. What did I know. I was just a Yankee from up north.
Even with the western style hankerchief that my host gave me to place over my nose, it was exactly as you described.
Yes, this.
GotGarlic
Chef Extraordinaire
"You're wrong!" "No, you're wrong!" [emoji38]
I have no doubt that some feedlots are better run than others, but anecdotes do not equal data. From my reading, most feedlots are responsibly run by relatively small farms with owners who care about their animals. You go on believing what you want. The bottom line is that cows are not fed just corn kernels. And remember that corn is a plant, not just the cob. We don't eat the rest of the plant - stalks, leaves, husks - because it's a grass and doesn't have a lot of nutrition for us. But it's great for cattle.
Cattle feed has a lot more ingredients than just corn. It's big business and ranchers have dieticians and veterinarians available for advice. If you're interested, you can look it up yourself since you don't like my sources.
cowman
Assistant Cook
I know this is a dated thread, but will make a few comments. I know a little about raising beef cattle. My backyard:
1. Beef cattle in feedlots don't stay there very long. That is where they are' finished'. Finishing means where some more weight is put on in the muscle (the part we eat) and the outer layer of fat is put on. Most of the marbling would have already been acquired while on momma's milk and grass the previous 7-13 months.
2. No beef cattle producer raisescattle on grain only. Their rumen won't handle it very easily and about the only time I have seen it done is in the show industry and specifically show steers. Trying to raise cattle on grain alone or even at high volumes is a recipe for a trainwreck because of what is known as acidosis, and it can quickly be fatal.
3. Feedlots may use a lot of corn, but more often than not, it's a mixed protein ration that includes soybean meal, crimped or ground corn kernels and the fibrous part of the ear and stalk, barley, crimped or steamed oats, cottonseed meal, beet pulp, ground up hay, a sweetener such as molasses for energy. Finishing on 100% corn is a practice from the past that simply isn't done nowadays.
4. Not all Nolan Ryan beef is 'all natural, 100% grass raised and finished'. His company offers several different options.
Nolan Ryan Texas Angus Beef Specifications:
Black Angus
All-Natural*
Cattle are harvested in Texas
Product of the USA
USDA Choice or higher for optimal marbling
Pasture raised and grain finished for juicy, flavorful beef
Wet aged for a minimum of 14 days to ensure tenderness and great flavor
USDA Certified Tender** program to deliver consistent and uniform product
By far, MOST of the beef you buy retail or in restaurants is raised on family owned farms, on pasture, is then hauled to the local sale barn to be sold to an order buyer, shipped to a feedlot or background operation for finishing, and then on to a processor.
Grass fed/grass finished beef is a growing trend and I have nothing against it at all but the length of time it takes to finish the animal on grass is not cost effective for most small (under100 head) producers. It can easily take 2 years to 2 1/2 years to finish one out on grass where they can be finished out on a grain grass combination in just a few months, depending how old they are when finishing begins.
1. Beef cattle in feedlots don't stay there very long. That is where they are' finished'. Finishing means where some more weight is put on in the muscle (the part we eat) and the outer layer of fat is put on. Most of the marbling would have already been acquired while on momma's milk and grass the previous 7-13 months.
2. No beef cattle producer raisescattle on grain only. Their rumen won't handle it very easily and about the only time I have seen it done is in the show industry and specifically show steers. Trying to raise cattle on grain alone or even at high volumes is a recipe for a trainwreck because of what is known as acidosis, and it can quickly be fatal.
3. Feedlots may use a lot of corn, but more often than not, it's a mixed protein ration that includes soybean meal, crimped or ground corn kernels and the fibrous part of the ear and stalk, barley, crimped or steamed oats, cottonseed meal, beet pulp, ground up hay, a sweetener such as molasses for energy. Finishing on 100% corn is a practice from the past that simply isn't done nowadays.
4. Not all Nolan Ryan beef is 'all natural, 100% grass raised and finished'. His company offers several different options.
Nolan Ryan Texas Angus Beef Specifications:
Black Angus
All-Natural*
Cattle are harvested in Texas
Product of the USA
USDA Choice or higher for optimal marbling
Pasture raised and grain finished for juicy, flavorful beef
Wet aged for a minimum of 14 days to ensure tenderness and great flavor
USDA Certified Tender** program to deliver consistent and uniform product
By far, MOST of the beef you buy retail or in restaurants is raised on family owned farms, on pasture, is then hauled to the local sale barn to be sold to an order buyer, shipped to a feedlot or background operation for finishing, and then on to a processor.
Grass fed/grass finished beef is a growing trend and I have nothing against it at all but the length of time it takes to finish the animal on grass is not cost effective for most small (under100 head) producers. It can easily take 2 years to 2 1/2 years to finish one out on grass where they can be finished out on a grain grass combination in just a few months, depending how old they are when finishing begins.
Sir_Loin_of_Beef
Chef Extraordinaire
I have no idea because I haven't purchased meat from a supermarket in years. I buy most of my meat from Omaha Steaks, and what they don't carry I buy in a meat market. Of course, because I live on the pacific coast I buy all my seafood locally.
cowman
Assistant Cook
I very much suspect the differences noted in taste are partly if not mostly because of genetic changes that are made over our lifetimes. The large frame, overly fat Hereford and Angus cattle I remember from my youth would be laughed at today, as the move to smaller frames, shorter legs, longer thicker and more muscular but leaner carcasses has been upbred for for decades now.
Grass finished vs grain finished beef does have a definite difference tho, and more often, a difference in color, especially in the outer fat and marbling. Grass finished beef has a tendency to often have a yellowish color to it.
I have had good grass raised/grass finished beef and crappy grass raised/grass finished and the same true for grass raised/grain finished beef.
Grass finished vs grain finished beef does have a definite difference tho, and more often, a difference in color, especially in the outer fat and marbling. Grass finished beef has a tendency to often have a yellowish color to it.
I have had good grass raised/grass finished beef and crappy grass raised/grass finished and the same true for grass raised/grain finished beef.
