Proofing box build

[Chef Odin]

Proofing box update. I got the box set up and tried a trial run with my sourdough starter. After about 5 minutes, the box had an awful stench coming from it. I traced it down to the gorilla tape. The box never got over 90 degrees F but that was enough to cause the tape outgas something fierce. Mc Nasty..

I removed all the gorilla tape and replaced it with aluminum tape. Problem solved.

I had to remove the shelf paper to fix everything but I will cut some new stuff and put it back in. I liked the look of that.

Next issue was my PID controller wasn't regulating properly. So I did an autotune on the unit and SHAZAM!!! it is working like a charm.

Can't wait to get some bread rising in it.

Chef Odin

 

[blissful]

@Chef Odin I'm looking forward to hearing how the proofing goes for you now.

What is the approximate cost of the wires and modules for the fan and heat, to plug into the wall?
The cost of your advice on this?
I'm curious about the cost of your set up, because I'm thinking of replacing the box of the dehydrator.
I can come up with a box with a door, with a place to slide in shelves, and I have shelves made of stainless steel. OR I can buy a dehydrator replacement.
I need to decide which way I want to go. Your advice?

 

[Chef Odin]

I spent around $20 for the parts. I used scrap wire and heatsinks but that isn't terribly expensive.

If you have a cabinet that you want to use, setting up a heater for proofing is pretty easy. I would be glad to assist if you wish to go that route.

Chef Odin

 

[blissful]

@Chef Odin I do wish to go that route! That's generous of you.
I don't have a cabinet ready yet.
I have 15 x 15 inch stainless steel shelves, so the width of the cabinet will be around 15x15 plus the thickness of the material and some wiggle room for sliding the shelves in and out.
About how much room for the heater and fan would I need from the back of the shelf to the back of the dehydrator to fit them in? (mr bliss will build it with the plain square box excalibur dehydrator in mind)
My experience with electronics is to wire a lamp. I can follow directions.

 

[The Ghan]

Okay - once again excuse my ignorance but what is a proofing box and what is it for?

 

[dragnlaw]

For Bread making. Once your bread dough is mixed you need to let it "rest" during which time the yeast will activate and make the bread 'rise'. Usually done in a warm spot in the kitchen as it certainly needs the warmth to rise. Generally speaking the dough is then 'punched down' or deflated, shaped and left to 'rise' again after which it is then baked.
The term 'proofing' is what is given when the dough is resting and rising. You 'proof your dough', or you 'leave your dough to proof'.

A Proofing Box is an enclosed box to keep the dough from cold drafts and warm enough to let the yeast work and 'rise'.

Does that help?

 

[dragnlaw]

@blissful @Chef Odin when you are using a proofing area that is fitted with a fan - are you extra careful with your oiled plastic wrap to be sure nothing is exposed to the circulating air?
the one time I used my dehydrator some of the plastic came away while the dough was rising and as a result the exposed dough created a dry crust which I could not fully incorporate back into the dough when deflated and shaped.
I was not too happy about that, so I'm just wondering if you do something extra or different.

 

[blissful]

@dragnlaw, I've proofed bread in the microwave, when I had the extra large microwave. I'd put a big bowl of water in it, let it steam up and heat up the microwave, remove the water bowl. Then I'd put the loaves of bread in the steamy microwave and close it but not turn it on.

I still have to figure out how to make the dehydrator hotter or cooler with a temperature knob 90-150 f. I'll have to tear apart the dehydrator and see how that is arranged.

 

[blissful]

I won't need anything for humidity in this box. Just temperature control and a fan.
My hubs was saying that he'd have to get the more expensive pressed board to hold up to the heat. I don't think his heart is into building it...but he is building small hives right now that is also a box. He's a very good box builder.
I looked at some things available on facebook market place. This cabinet jumped out at me and is available, it has 16 inches deep, 20 some inches long and I'm not sure how many inches inside height yet. I haven't bought it yet. I'm waiting on her to give me all the exact interior measurements, she said tomorrow.

I'm envisioning a vertical board towards the right side, going from front to back to hold one side of the 15 inch trays. The electric parts and fan and heater to the right of the vertical board. We'd drill a hole into the back of the cabinet to plug it in.

 

[dragnlaw]

@blissful I did do the micro-wave once. But just didn't find it stayed all that warm for the hour+ I needed. The dehydrator worked fine but next time I'll preheat it for a bit, then turn it down super low, below the 95 mark. I have a plastic tent (from the mushrooms) and even though it has vent holes in it I think I'll have enough room for the bowl and a cup of hot water for some steam. My instant read thermometer goes very low, when I turn it on it usually shows 65/67. This way I can check on the temp.
Worth a try!

What do you think would be the ideal temperature to aim for in your box. 80? 85?

 

[blissful]

@dragnlaw I'm going to need a knob to control the temperature from 90-150 deg F. I can't think of a thing we need it hotter or cooler than those temperatures. Tempeh 95 yogurt 110 natto 110 crystalized honey 105 drying vegetables 125 drying fruits 135 drying greens and herbs 90, that's all I can think of.

 

[Chef Odin]

@Chef Odin I do wish to go that route! That's generous of you.
I don't have a cabinet ready yet.
I have 15 x 15 inch stainless steel shelves, so the width of the cabinet will be around 15x15 plus the thickness of the material and some wiggle room for sliding the shelves in and out.
About how much room for the heater and fan would I need from the back of the shelf to the back of the dehydrator to fit them in? (mr bliss will build it with the plain square box excalibur dehydrator in mind)
My experience with electronics is to wire a lamp. I can follow directions.

That cabinet will work great. You would need around 2" square and 1.5" deep for a 40mm fan. An 80W bar heater is pretty small so I don't see any reason to have concerns about space. Here is a list of materials you will need. Wiring is pretty easy. Pretty much just point A to point B. The only challenge will be to power and wire the fan. You will need to solder for that. If you can't solder, a 12VDC wall wart power supply that can source over 250mA will work just fine. I used an old wall wart power supply. I just broke it out of the case and resoldered the wires for my use. Pretty easy. This controller set-up will work for any temperature you might need. It regulates very tightly once it is autotuned.

Fan and heater placement isn't critical as long as you remember the golden rule of thermal management. Heat always rises...

AC Power cord
SSR (Solid State Relay)
PID Controller (REX C-100, XMT-7100
k-type thermocouple
Heat sink
120 VAC heater (80 - 200 Watt)
Fan 12 VDC 40mm x 10mm
Wire
12 VDC 250mA or > power supply.

You can get bundles of PID controller, thermocouple and SSR from AliExpress for under $20. You can also get the fan and power supply if you need to.

Let me know if I can help with anything else.

 

[dragnlaw]

@blissful I have those settings as well. I was thinking of the proofing though. 90 is too warm. I should think 85 is the limit?
But I suppose if the box is large enough 90 is doable?

 

[Chef Odin]

@blissful @Chef Odin when you are using a proofing area that is fitted with a fan - are you extra careful with your oiled plastic wrap to be sure nothing is exposed to the circulating air?
the one time I used my dehydrator some of the plastic came away while the dough was rising and as a result the exposed dough created a dry crust which I could not fully incorporate back into the dough when deflated and shaped.
I was not too happy about that, so I'm just wondering if you do something extra or different.

That is a good point. I think for my first go, I am going to use a damp towel and see how that works out. I am not that concerned about plastic wrap getting in the fan as the fan is blowing up so the plastic would have to travel into the air return, across the bottom of the box, dodging all the foam and electronics there then get sucked back up into the fan. Possible but very unlikely.

 

[dragnlaw]

That is a good point. I think for my first go, I am going to use a damp towel and see how that works out. I am not that concerned about plastic wrap getting in the fan as the fan is blowing up so the plastic would have to travel into the air return, across the bottom of the box, dodging all the foam and electronics there then get sucked back up into the fan. Possible but very unlikely.

Oh My... no, my plastic didn't fly around, just came up away from the dough along the edges, creating a spot for the air to dry the dough.
The plastic stay on top of the dough - likely due to the oiling it had. Maybe the piece that came loose was closest to the fan and in a direct line with it.
As I said before - I can jury-rig a box in front of the dehydrator making a much larger box.
I'll also use the plastic where I will be able to see the progress of the proofing action. I don't want it to rise too much too quickly!

 

[Chef Odin]

Oh My... no, my plastic didn't fly around, just came up away from the dough along the edges, creating a spot for the air to dry the dough.
The plastic stay on top of the dough - likely due to the oiling it had. Maybe the piece that came loose was closest to the fan and in a direct line with it.
As I said before - I can jury-rig a box in front of the dehydrator making a much larger box.
I'll also use the plastic where I will be able to see the progress of the proofing action. I don't want it to rise too much too quickly!

Thanks for the clarification. The fan I use is a pretty low CFM rating so I doubt it could pull plastic off of anything.

 

[dragnlaw]

Have no idea the CFM rating on these dehydrators but when I dry herbs, nothing moves around so must be pretty low.

 

[Chef Odin]

Have no idea the CFM rating on these dehydrators but when I dry herbs, nothing moves around so must be pretty low.

My dehydrator has some areas that are fairly windy. They must route the air for minimal turbulence inside the unit. Never really thought about it as I mostly dehydrate vegetables.

 

[blissful]

I heard from the cabinet owner this morning and the depth of it isn't enough for the 15 inch square shelves. I'll keep looking for an appropriate cabinet.

@Chef Odin I'll get back to you in a PM. I need to make it temperature variable 90-150 deg F. I think that the parts combined together that you are using will do that and cost less! I'm not as comfortable as you in putting those parts together. I could put them together but I'm afraid I might not do it safely enough because of my lack of experience.

I have a controller for electric that depends on an on temperature and an off temperature. I used it to keep the extra fridge at 50 deg F as a cheese fridge. For a dehydrator or proofing box I would plug the fan and heat into the controller, set the controller for say on at 80 deg F and off at 85 deg F. This would keep the temperature steady between 80 to 85. Or it can be set tighter from 80 to 82 deg F.

Amazon.com

This one I bought more than 10 years ago. They come in different manufacturers for $16 to $30.

 

[Chef Odin]

I heard from the cabinet owner this morning and the depth of it isn't enough for the 15 inch square shelves. I'll keep looking for an appropriate cabinet.

@Chef Odin I'll get back to you in a PM. I need to make it temperature variable 90-150 deg F. I think that the parts combined together that you are using will do that and cost less! I'm not as comfortable as you in putting those parts together. I could put them together but I'm afraid I might not do it safely enough because of my lack of experience.

I have a controller for electric that depends on an on temperature and an off temperature. I used it to keep the extra fridge at 50 deg F as a cheese fridge. For a dehydrator or proofing box I would plug the fan and heat into the controller, set the controller for say on at 80 deg F and off at 85 deg F. This would keep the temperature steady between 80 to 85. Or it can be set tighter from 80 to 82 deg F.

Amazon.com

This one I bought more than 10 years ago. They come in different manufacturers for $16 to $30.

There are a lot of options that will work for your purpose. That controller you posted would work fine. I guess it comes down to just how precise you want everything to be. I generally stay away from off the shelf controllers as most of them use relay outputs which will always fail before the control electronics. That is why I use SSRs for power switching.

In any case, I can help you set up whatever you decide to go with. I take a most bang for the buck approach. Why spend more for the same results? Have a great day!!

Chef Odin