The case of the disappearing meat (into chili sauce)?

[BAPyessir6]

I would also ask "what temperature was the braise?" 8 hours ate like 300F? That's likely to be mush.

The secret to brazing is to keep a small, sharp knife of skewer handy. Just when the knife/skewer just slides through the meat with little resistance, it is done. Forget time or temperature, probe the meat regularly to get the right "feel.".

CD

Fascinating! I was braising at like 250 F but I've heard you can go as low as 200F (also that if the water is boiling it's too hot/strong of a cook; you want it at a simmer). Is the simmer thing correct?

 

[BAPyessir6]

They do, although the reason is exactly opposite to why it breaks down the protein.
The mostly citric acid in the tomato does help break down the protein by the denaturing process but it does that by lowering the pH environment making it acidic. Baking soda raises the pH environment making it more alkaline which makes the meat more tender but I never use baking soda for velveting and use cornstarch, egg white, shaoxing wine and soy sauce and haven't actually seen baking soda used, but I'm sure some do.

But I can leave chicken if it hasn't been overcooked in a tomato sauce for days without it basically breaking up or disappearing and like I said that was from overcooking and moving the ingredients around that eventually breaks up the protein into small and smaller pieces and eventually your asking yourself where did the chicken go, lol

You're very knowledgeable about so many things! I'm so glad to be part of a forum of so many smart people who know so much about stuff I don't.

True true. If acid did it, orange chicken would be orange mush after 1 day.

 

[Andy M.]

Fascinating! I was braising at like 250 F but I've heard you can go as low as 200F (also that if the water is boiling it's too hot/strong of a cook; you want it at a simmer). Is the simmer thing correct?

Yes, the simmer thing is correct.

 

[BAPyessir6]

The

Yes, the simmer thing is correct.

Cool!

This is a picture of the chili I made. After braising (and braising more!) beef, I added some black beans, a few red beans, a small can of tomatoes and tomato sauce, and also lots of rehydrated/toasted guajillo/ancho/chipotle peppers. I also added a bit of cream cheese and heavy cream (I know this is all sacrilege!!!) to cut down on the heat since it was pretty spicy and this is chili for a bunch of white folk.

It's a bit loose, but my first attempt was very very gloppy and thick. So I was much happier with this attempt.

I didn't enter it as I'm super de DUPER competitive, but the gal who won (7 times already) uses admittedly canned Hormel chili. Which is a bit annoying to me, but the rest of the chilis aside from mine didn't even use dried chilis (they all used packet taco seasoning) or anything but ground beef.

 

[caseydog]

Fascinating! I was braising at like 250 F but I've heard you can go as low as 200F (also that if the water is boiling it's too hot/strong of a cook; you want it at a simmer). Is the simmer thing correct?

Yes on the simmer thing. You want a very gentle bubbling from the liquid.

Like others have said, I think you just went too long. Try the "probe tender" test, or as Emeril called it, "fork tender." Chef John also preaches that.

CD

 

[jennyema]

Fascinating! I was braising at like 250 F but I've heard you can go as low as 200F (also that if the water is boiling it's too hot/strong of a cook; you want it at a simmer). Is the simmer thing correct?

Yes. But don’t overthink it. 225 or 250 in the oven or even 300 is good. You just don’t want it to boil. Boiling ruins any kind of protein. And don’t try 200. That low is never necessary for any kind of cooking.

I’m making Julia Child’s beef bourgoinon (sp?) for a party we are having this weekend. It’s a bit labor intensive but delicious. It cooks for 2 1/2 or 3 hours at 275, as I recall. I make it from my head now and don’t look at the actual recipe.

 

[BAPyessir6]

Coming back to this thread for the most recent chuck I braised! This time I did it for 2 hours (at 300F), then left to go to a small group, then did it about 1.5 more hours. (3.5 hours in total at 300F). I think it turned out way better thanks to you guys! I checked it with a toothpick and it gave me a little resistance, but not much.

 

[Andy M.]

Coming back to this thread for the most recent chuck I braised! This time I did it for 2 hours (at 300F), then left to go to a small group, then did it about 1.5 more hours. (3.5 hours in total at 300F). I think it turned out way better thanks to you guys! I checked it with a toothpick and it gave me a little resistance, but not much.

That's great.

 

[jennyema]

Yum!