Published Recipe Discrepancies

[GB]

GB, how does anyone know RR is saying the exact measurement doesn't matter unless she states that in the recipe?

She states it quite often Andy. She probably says it once every couple of shows. I don't feel like digging my one RR cookbook out right now, but I would be willing to bet that she says something about it in the preface as well.

Not to mention that this is true of most cooking recipes, not just RR recipes. In most cases if you use a little extra of this or a little less than that then you will still have a successful recipe. I hardly ever measure anything when cooking and I would call myself a pretty decent cook. I can promise that when I am following a recipe though, it is never exactly the amounts that were written down.

 

[QSis]

But I believe most recipes should be very specific and then give variations as lagniappe, but not to confuse the reader.

I had to look up "lagniappe", auntdot! GREAT word!

I wish you lived next door to me!



Lee

 

[Katie H]

I had to look up "lagniappe", auntdot! GREAT word!

I wish you lived next door to me!



Lee

Hi, Lee. Here's Webster's definition. Ain't it great?

 

[Andy M.]

She states it quite often Andy. She probably says it once every couple of shows. I don't feel like digging my one RR cookbook out right now, but I would be willing to bet that she says something about it in the preface as well.

Not to mention that this is true of most cooking recipes, not just RR recipes. In most cases if you use a little extra of this or a little less than that then you will still have a successful recipe. I hardly ever measure anything when cooking and I would call myself a pretty decent cook. I can promise that when I am following a recipe though, it is never exactly the amounts that were written down.

It's not you or I who will have an issue with RR's type of recipe. It's the beginner. Someone who knows so little about cooking that they are afraid to guess and don't know enough to wing it.

I have a daughter who, while quite intelligent, has no cooking experience and hasn't learned to deal with such uncertainties. I often get calls about what does this mean and can I do this instead of that. She tasted a new potato salad recipe of mine a while ago and started asking, "Can I use celery instead of cukes?", "Can I leave out the bacon?" Do I have to use red potatoes?" Obvious to you and me but not to everyone. RR presents her cooking as not gourmet, but easy and quick. This is attractive to novice cooks. Her recipes have to take that into consideration.

My point is that an imprecise recipe excludes or is not usable by some cooks, while a precise recipe is usable by all. Some will measure every ingredient exactly as the precise recipe says while others will "eyeball" it or change the amount.

As to your other point. RR has to address the flexibility of amounts on every recipe. If you go to food network for a recipe, you don't have access to that part of a cookbook where she says it's OK to estimate.

 

[GB]

It's not you or I who will have an issue with RR's type of recipe. It's the beginner. Someone who knows so little about cooking that they are afraid to guess and don't know enough to wing it.

Which is exactly why she tries to teach people how to wing it. She will tell you that the recipe calls for 2 tablespoons of oil, or twice around the pan.

As to your other point. RR has to address the flexibility of amounts on every recipe. If you go to food network for a recipe, you don't have access to that part of a cookbook where she says it's OK to estimate.

If you go to food network and look at her recipes then you don't have to access that part of her book. The reason being that her recipes are written with actual amounts.

 

[Katie H]

Just to give my take on this subject. Whenever I try a new recipe, I do it as the recipe is written the FIRST time. This way I find out what it was meant to taste like. Then, if I feel it needs to be tweaked, for my preferences, I make my adjustments.

The "palm" measurement factor is as varied as there are cooks. I'm a female, but I have very large hands. Therefore, my "palm, pinch, etc." measurement will be very different from someone who has smaller hands.

One of the things that is wonderful about cooking is the ability for all of us to customize and/or change a recipe to suit our taste. Viva la difference!!

 

[Andy M.]

To get off RR for a moment, I also have a problem with ingredients measured in bunches, such as parsley, scallions, etc.

I'm reminded of a humerous story about a young bride who wanted to impress her new hubby by cooking her great grandmother's recipe for beef stew. IT was a disaster. Tasteless and blah.

The recipe listed the first step as, 'buy 50 cents worth of stew beef'...

My entire point in this thread is, while both precise and imprecise recipes can result in excellent dishes, only precise recipes are assured of being completely understandable to all.

 

[Andy M.]

Just to give my take on this subject. Whenever I try a new recipe, I do it as the recipe is written the FIRST time. This way I find out what it was meant to taste like. Then, if I feel it needs to be tweaked, for my preferences, I make my adjustments...

That's what I do as well, Katie.

 

[GB]

only precise recipes are assured of being completely understandable to all.

If that were really true then we would have a heck of a lot less posts on this website.

 

[Andy M.]

On the contrary, we often get questions about how to interpret confusing (imprecise) recipes. I remember one member asking what RR meant when she said to 'eyeball it'.

If the recipe had said 2 tablespoons of extra virgin olive oil (it's OK to exstimate this amount), it may have been clearer.

 

[GB]

How many times have we seen a question asking what "2 cups of flour, sifted" means?

 

[keltin]

Which is exactly why she tries to teach people how to wing it. She will tell you that the recipe calls for 2 tablespoons of oil, or twice around the pan.

I have to agree with GB here as this is an excellent point. To RR's credit, she did give a precise measurement which was 1/3 Cup. Parenthetically, she equated that to two handfuls.

This allows the novice to learn how to wing it without precise measurements, and it also gives insights to RR’s style of cooking. Since RR said upfront that 1/3 cup was used, it is easy to deconstruct what she means by a “handful”. In learning what she means by a “handful” you not only learn to wing it on your own, but also learn to cook more of her recipes in a casual manner.

The only downside I see to this approach is if it were a completely new cook that didn’t have a measuring cup and had no idea what 1/3 cup was. For a completely green novice that didn’t own, has never owned, was not using a measuring cup, and had never used a measuring cup, I see a problem.....but really, if they aren’t using a measuring cup and never plan on using one, they have more problems ahead of them than simply understanding what RR means by a handful.

And even when measurements are precise, they are often “wrong”. I can’t count the number of times when working with breaded items that need to be browned in oil. The recipe would specifically say 3 Tbsp of oil, and that is no where near enough to get through the whole batch. Not to mention salt and pepper measurements. I’ve made whole pots of stew that the recipe asks for 1/8 tsp of salt......maybe that is enough for some people, but that is no where near enough salt for my 2 quarts of stew (and none of the other ingredients brought any sodium to the stew either).

 

[Andy M.]

How many times have we seen a question asking what "2 cups of flour, sifted" means?

Exactly my point! An imprecise instruction, abbreviated for the sake of saving space. "Measure two cups of flour then sift it."

 

[GB]

I disagree. I think it is very precise. It is not an abbreviation. The comma is used to show when the sifting should take place. The flip side of this is one we get just as many questions about. 2 cups of sifted flour.

 

[ChefJune]

As far as Martha baby, she has been known to purposely leave an ingredient or two out of her posted recipes so you can't duplicate it.

She has also been known to copy recipes verbatim from published books to her own without benefit of any kind of acknowledgement...

 

[ChefJune]

I disagree. I think it is very precise. It is not an abbreviation. The comma is used to show when the sifting should take place. The flip side of this is one we get just as many questions about. 2 cups of sifted flour.

and "2 cups of sifted flour" is not the same as "2 cups of flour, sifted." Confusing to a novice baker.

 

[Andy M.]

I disagree. I think it is very precise. It is not an abbreviation. The comma is used to show when the sifting should take place. The flip side of this is one we get just as many questions about. 2 cups of sifted flour.

Your previous post pointed out that this is a common question on DC. If the direction were precise, there would be no questions. The instruction is open to interpretation and therefore confusing. Only because we are more experienced, do we know the recipe convention that makes the distinction between 2 C sifted flour and 2 C of flour, sifted. From our vantage point, it's obvious but a novice is uncertain to start and this makes it worse.

 

[GB]

OK I think I see what you are saying and I will agree with it.

 

[RPCookin]

Hey - thanks for that link Kitchenelf - recipe saved & looks absolutely delicious.

Like I said before, while I'm not a fan of Ms. Ray's show/personality, I've enjoyed many of her recipes & have one of her cookbooks. In fact, since I'm a "cheese whore" at heart, I personally didn't mind the extra cheese in my original complaint. I just felt it was misleading to new cooks. If she had said "a half handfull", that I wouldn't have had a problem with - lol!!!! I just found it hard to equate a full handfull of cheese with 1/3 cup.

IMO, if you want precision, use 1/3 cup. If you don't care then use the 2 handsful. Seems to me that she gave you the option to go either way... and 1/3 cup IS precise. 2 handfuls can't be precise (I mean, what if Kareem is a cook?), but it's more in keeping with how I cook, so I don't have any issue with it. About the only time I worry about precision is in baking.

And have you ever seen RR? She is tiny, and her hands are very small. IMO for her, 2 handsful WOULD be about 1/3 cup.

 

[RPCookin]

And even when measurements are precise, they are often “wrong”. I can’t count the number of times when working with breaded items that need to be browned in oil. The recipe would specifically say 3 Tbsp of oil, and that is no where near enough to get through the whole batch. Not to mention salt and pepper measurements. I’ve made whole pots of stew that the recipe asks for 1/8 tsp of salt......maybe that is enough for some people, but that is no where near enough salt for my 2 quarts of stew (and none of the other ingredients brought any sodium to the stew either).

I have found from experience that a great many recipes seem to be scared of over flavoring. I'd say that 90% of the dishes I make regularly have notations in the margins to double this or that herb or spice. Are they really afraid that people will be put off if a dish has FLAVOR?