Thickening sauces

[ibsriv]

My wife loves Chinese Lemon Chicken, which I cook for her often. The lemon sauce I make is great, but I cannot thicken it properly. I usually use cornstarch disoved in water and add it to the simmering sauce, but have also tried arrowroot (very expensive) which did not do any better. I've tried to make it a little ahead of time and let it cool to thicken, boiled it and tried to thicken it thru simmering and evaporation.....always too thin. Anyone have any suggestions? Thanks

Steve

 

[Andy M.]

I make a slurry with cornstarch and a room temperature liquid and add it to the wok, bring it to a boil and it thickens.

If you do this and it's not thick enough, the solution may be as simple as using more cornstarch.

 

[FryBoy]

Cut down on the liquid in the dish, or cook it over high heat until it's boiled down a bit before adding the cornstarch.

Use more cornstarch than you have been and be sure to cook it ever high heat for a few minutes until it thickens.

 

[ibsriv]

Thickening suuce

Thanks, Andy...that was fast! I usuallly make about a cup of sauce in a seperate saucepan so that we can use it over the breaded chicken and rice. The base of the sauce is chicken broth. I use a "slurry" of water (cold) and cornstarch. It never gets thick enuf when hot, but if I store it in the refrig., it eventually "clots" and gets so thick it's unusable (can be thinned). Usually end up using several tbs of cornstarch which also dilutes the flavor.

 

[Andy M.]

Some day when you have a minute, do an experiment to determine how much corn starch you need to thicken the volume of sauce you make for the recipe.

Two tablespoons of flour will thicken a cup of liquid. Cornstarch does not have the thickening power of flour so you'll need more.

Also, make your cornstarch slurry with more chicken broth instead of water, it tastes better.

 

[FryBoy]

Cornstarch does not have the thickening power of flour so you'll need more.

That's not my understanding -- which is hardly to say you're wrong! But I've always understood that cornstarch has more thickening power than flour, which is consistent with the information on the Kingsford/Argo websitwe, which states that corn starch has twice the "thickening power" of flour, so it's necessary to use only half as much.

Is your experience different from this?

 

[ibsriv]

When we order this dish in a Chinese restaurant they serve it with a thick, shiny ssauce over it that is just wonderful. I usually use at least 3 tbs of cornstarch which dilutes the flavor ( I start with a more tangy suace for this reason) and add yellow food coloring because it becomes "pale" and less appetizing. When I make dishes such as Shrimp w/ Fermented Black Beans thickening in the wok is easy, but there is much less sauce than in the lemon. Maybe cooking it down is the answer, but it sure seems like a bit of work and time consuming.

 

[FryBoy]

I also found this information on the Argo/Kingsford site, on their FAQ page, which may help with the runny lemon chicken problem.

 

[Andy M.]

Fryboy, you're right. Corn starch is a more potent thickened. Thanks for straightening me out.

ibsriv:

I read that an acidic environment reduces the thickening effect of corn starch so you'd have to use more or try another thickener. This link recommends arrowroot. tapioca may also work.

 

[ibsriv]

WOW! It seems as if I've broken almost every "rule", Doug ( by the way, I;m down the road in Carlsbad). I:

1) Use 1/4 cup sugar to approx 1 1/4 C broth for that sweet/tart taste
2) Use juice of approx 2 lemons
3) Stir loke crazy (of course with a wisk) when I add the cornstarch -- otherwise it comes out of solution & "cllots"

I've also tried flour, but don't like the taste it adds. Tapioca leaves little "fish-eyes". Potato flour didn't help either. Maybe I need to make friends with the cook at a local Chinese restaurant.

 

[ibsriv]

Maybe I should make the thickened broth first and then add the lemon & sugar???? And stir gently.....

 

[FryBoy]

I have to say, adding MORE water seems counter-intuitive to me! But what the heck -- they make the stuff, I only eat it! Worth a shot.

Carlsbad is a great place now, beautiful beaches. BUT, when I was a kid growing up in San Diego, north county was not a pretty place. Sometimes progress is actually good!

Well, the company says to add more water if you have too much sugar or too much fat, so I'd try that first.

And try adding the lemon juice just before serving.

And don't spit in it!

 

[Lynan]

My wife loves Chinese Lemon Chicken, which I cook for her often. The lemon sauce I make is great, but I cannot thicken it properly. I usually use cornstarch disoved in water and add it to the simmering sauce, but have also tried arrowroot (very expensive) which did not do any better. I've tried to make it a little ahead of time and let it cool to thicken, boiled it and tried to thicken it thru simmering and evaporation.....always too thin. Anyone have any suggestions? Thanks

Steve

Have you tried dipping your chicken pieces in corn flour/starch before beginning to cook? The Chinese do this with most meats in a stir fry, and it helps with the thickening.
Also, it is my experience that you can overcook anything thickened with corn flour/starch to the point where it will revert back to thin.

Now for something nearly completely different...I use instant potato huh: ) to thicken many types of soups, casseroles or stews. The only time I use it, apart from for potato topped pies that need to be held for a period of time.

 

[ibsriv]

Instant potato is a cool idea! Would that work on something like a crock pot pot roast? Would you add it after it's done, or before cooking by adding it dry? Right now I use tapioca (not instant) at the beginning.....

This is my first time on the forum & it's great! By the way, guess what we had for dinner tonite & what motivated me to discover the forum....

 

[Andy M.]

...Tapioca leaves little "fish-eyes"...

You need to use tapioca starch, a powder that dissolves completely. You used pearl tapioca, which leaves the "fish eyes".

If you can't find the starch, put some pearl tapioca in a blender and powder it.

 

[TATTRAT]

whenever I hear sauce and thickened..then Asian...It is cornstarch all the way. Look to thin the slurry and add slowly. Remember, like a roux, it will thicken upon cooling. Thicken accordingly.

 

[scott123]

You can lower the acidity of your sauce and help the corn starch thicken better by subbing some lemon zest for lemon juice. Starches generally are not that happy thickening in acidic environments. I'm not sure arrowroot will solve your problem either.

The one thickener that I know, for a fact, is happy within a wide range of pH levels is xanthan gum. I would try at least one of the following.

1. Use corn starch and a tiny amount of xanthan (very little is needed)
2. Use zest/juice rather than just juice

 

[ironchef]

Like Andy said, you need to add more slurry in the initial stage, bring it to a full boil, add more if needed, and immediately remove it from the heat. Prolonged exposure to heat will break down the thickening properties of the slurry.

Also, any sauce that's been thickened with a slurry will be thinner upon reheating unless you add more slurry. A slurry is meant to be a temporary liaison. It will almost always lose it's thickening power everytime you cool and reheat it, or cook it for too long a period of time.

 

[Ishbel]

You could try using arrowroot. That's what I use when I want to thicken but not 'colour' a sauce.

 

[Michael in FtW]

I think IronChef will see where I am going with this ... and if I am wrong he will slap me on the head and yell at me in his best Gordon Ramsay voice ...

1) Cornstarch will thin out from overcooking
2) Make a slurry with as little liquid as possible - and make more than you think you might need ... cornstarch is cheap - think of it as salt where you season to taste - here you are thickening to taste.
3) Reduce your sauce BEFORE you add the cornstarch!!!
4) Stir your cornstarch slurry before you add it ... I mean right before you add it
5) Add the slurry - stir a couple of times ... and just as soon at it comes to a boil - remove it from the heat.

Most Asian cooking is really pretty simple ... most American's screw it up because they try to over-complicate it.