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Old 09-15-2013, 12:33 AM   #41
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Originally Posted by TATTRAT View Post
you would be surprised. . . a LOT of copycat sites content are based solely on blatant copy/pasting, with NO credit to the OP or host of the content. Happens more and more every month.
Credit has nothing to do with it, and is no legal excuse that makes quoting a whole work legal.
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Old 09-15-2013, 12:43 AM   #42
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This site does not "own" any of the content posted by users. =) And permission from the author is all it takes to re-post a recipe or idea elsewhere. The truly original content posted here is practically nil.
The site claims copyright (at the bottom of every page) but in fact the only copyright the site has is the assemblage and organization of topics. Original posts are still the intellectual property of the persons who posted them, although posting them here in the forum implies permission for the forum to share them with the public. Permission for use.
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Old 09-15-2013, 12:56 AM   #43
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No, Cat. You don't have to do that. We trust that you are not using them for making money, but just for good eating. That's why we share recipes, so others can try them.
That would be an interesting legal argument. I submit that a restauranteur can use copyrighted recipes for profit as long as they make no reference to the copyrighted work. This is analogous to putting the directions in your own words.

The copyright applies to the words in the description. The use of a recipe cannot be copyrighted.

Do not confuse copyrighting with patents. I am well acquainted with copyright law because I am a published author, but I know virtually nothing about patent law.
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Old 09-15-2013, 01:01 AM   #44
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Oh no!

I have put some pictures on this website. Must I prove these are mine?

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No, somebody else would have to prove that they are not, and would have to have legal standing (would have to be the copyright owner or their legal representative.)
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Old 09-15-2013, 01:05 AM   #45
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Oh no!

I have put some pictures on this website. Must I prove these are mine?

Your friend,
~Cat
I'm presuming the photos came from your camera. You cannot legally use photos or images you did not create, except with permission from the IP creator.

If you took the photos yourself, then no problem. In fact in that case YOU are the copyright owner.
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Old 09-15-2013, 01:17 AM   #46
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If a recipe originated as someone else's but you have developed it to such an extent that it now is unrecognisable as the original, is it OK to post it as your own?
Yes, although in my case I always give a tip of the hat to the. Person who inspired me, for ethical reasons, and out of respect.

In fact every recipe on my website has both a credit notice (either it is my own creation, or who inspired it, even if that was my mom) and every page has a copyright notice.

Note again, USCO does not require a copyright notice, but it's a good idea..
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Old 09-15-2013, 01:22 AM   #47
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DC is governed by US copyright law and being we live in such a litigious society, it's best to err on the side of caution.
Every forum with a brain does the same. Except in Russia. They do not recognize US copyright law. Interesting but true.
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Old 09-15-2013, 01:24 AM   #48
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When a recipe is copyrighted, the copyright covers the preparation/cooking instructions, not the ingredients list. So changing the ingredients and not the directions does not make the recipe your own. It's necessary to make a "significant" change to the directions to avoid copyright issues.

Acknowledging the originator of a recipe when you post it does not make it OK. It's nothing more than an admission of guilt on your part. You knowingly posted someone else's property. Makes the law suit much easier to prosecute.

The solution is to post a link to the website that has the recipe and make reference to it in your post.

If you copy a recipe for your own use, that's not a problem. Just don't post it online later as your own work.
Quite!!!
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Old 09-15-2013, 01:31 AM   #49
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Oh no! I !posted a recipe but just told it was of the Bisquick website! I need to go and get the original, yes?

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Technically a problem, but in real life not a problem as long as Bisquick is an ingredient and you mentioned them a few times. And don't forget to capitalize their name!!!

In real life they call your post a commercial! )
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Old 09-15-2013, 07:14 AM   #50
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That would be an interesting legal argument. I submit that a restauranteur can use copyrighted recipes for profit as long as they make no reference to the copyrighted work. This is analogous to putting the directions in your own words.

The copyright applies to the words in the description. The use of a recipe cannot be copyrighted.

Do not confuse copyrighting with patents. I am well acquainted with copyright law because I am a published author, but I know virtually nothing about patent law.
I am not confused, I understand copyright law perfectly as I, too, am a published author. I'm attempting to explain a concept to a person whose first language is not English without being pedantic.
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Old 09-15-2013, 11:17 AM   #51
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Why is it one can post a picture from another site, for instance frank's knife picture in his tailgating thread, and not make mention of where it is originally from, but you cannot post the written word including the link where you found it?
That just doesn't make sense.
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Old 09-15-2013, 11:39 AM   #52
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Why is it one can post a picture from another site, for instance frank's knife picture in his tailgating thread, and not make mention of where it is originally from, but you cannot post the written word including the link where you found it?
That just doesn't make sense.
When you take a photo, just like when you write something, you automatically hold the copyright to that image. So it is a copyright violation to post a picture from any source, unless you took it or have permission from the copyright holder. People often think that because something is on the Internet, that makes it public domain and available for any use, but that's not so.
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Old 09-15-2013, 12:45 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by GotGarlic View Post
When you take a photo, just like when you write something, you automatically hold the copyright to that image. So it is a copyright violation to post a picture from any source, unless you took it or have permission from the copyright holder. People often think that because something is on the Internet, that makes it public domain and available for any use, but that's not so.
So you're saying posting a pic from another source is every bit as illegal as posting a recipe or quoting information. That's what I thought. Looks like the mods would have to remove half the pictures posted here showing a wok from Amazon or the knife with the funky fruit I mentioned
I'm in the section that thinks that if it's on the Internet it's there for the taking as long as the source is linked, be it picture or word. Like a footnote. It's just common sense. And after all you are linking it back to the source, so there is recognition.

I doubt very many original owners are pursuing this though.
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Old 09-15-2013, 01:24 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by pacanis View Post
So you're saying posting a pic from another source is every bit as illegal as posting a recipe or quoting information. That's what I thought. Looks like the mods would have to remove half the pictures posted here showing a wok from Amazon or the knife with the funky fruit I mentioned
I'm in the section that thinks that if it's on the Internet it's there for the taking as long as the source is linked, be it picture or word. Like a footnote. It's just common sense. And after all you are linking it back to the source, so there is recognition.

I doubt very many original owners are pursuing this though.
A lot of the pix are actually links to the photo.
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Old 09-15-2013, 03:09 PM   #55
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Originally Posted by Greg Who Cooks View Post
People cannot publish someone else's recipe, period. This applies even to unpublished works. I can cite USCO links tomorrow if anybody doubts this.
Just nit-picking here but if I quoted a recipe from Joe Bloggs' latest book, for sweet and sour earthworms with lime vinaigrette, wouldn't JB have to prove beyond doubt that it was his invention in the first place in order to bring a copyright case? Many recipes have their origins lost in the mists of time and many recipe methods involve well-known cooking techniques.

I've mentioned the activities of a certain lady cookery writer whose middle name should be "Plagiarise", elsewhere on DC, and I have seen several British and American chefs on television and in print, claiming to have invented the method of cooking a whole salmon to serve cold which has passed down our family from my Great Grandmother, who was born in the 1860s, and which first appeared in print in the 1700s. The first case doesn't seem to bother anyone and in the second case both Meg Dodds, who wrote the 18thC book, and my GGM are not in a position to sue.
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Old 09-15-2013, 03:39 PM   #56
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Just nit-picking here but if I quoted a recipe from Joe Bloggs' latest book, for sweet and sour earthworms with lime vinaigrette, wouldn't JB have to prove beyond doubt that it was his invention in the first place in order to bring a copyright case? Many recipes have their origins lost in the mists of time and many recipe methods involve well-known cooking techniques...
If it's published in a book, it's copyrighted. The author can sue you for publishing without permission. If it's not his original work, it's up to the real owner of the recipe to deal with the author and prove it's plagiarized. They that person can come after you.

Most copyrighted recipes employ well-known cooking techniques. It's not the technique that's copyrighted, it's how the author employs it with the ingredients he empoys.
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Old 09-15-2013, 04:01 PM   #57
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And, in U.S. copyright law, the copyright expires after a certain number of years, depending on when a work was originally created (the number of years has changed over time). After x number of years, it is deemed to be in the public domain. It would be useful to review Steve's link to the U.S. Copyright Office for the details.
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Old 09-15-2013, 04:08 PM   #58
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And, in U.S. copyright law, the copyright expires after a certain number of years, depending on when a work was originally created (the number of years has changed over time). After x number of years, it is deemed to be in the public domain. It would be useful to review Steve's link to the U.S. Copyright Office for the details.
Novels remain copywrited for x numbers of years after the author has died with monies going to their estate. Executors of the estate can also renew the copywrite for another number of years or buy the rights to the canon of work. It's been thirteen years since I was embroiled in this aspect, so the number of years may have changed.
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Old 09-15-2013, 04:26 PM   #59
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And, in U.S. copyright law, the copyright expires after a certain number of years, depending on when a work was originally created (the number of years has changed over time). After x number of years, it is deemed to be in the public domain. It would be useful to review Steve's link to the U.S. Copyright Office for the details.
Oops, I misremembered. Greg was talking about copyright, not Steve, and he didn't post a link to the U.S. Copyright Office. So here's a link to the FAQ: Frequently Asked Questions about Copyright
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Old 09-15-2013, 04:28 PM   #60
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I have two booklets that I have had for years. The first one is Better Homes and Gardens Our Own Favorite RECIPES. It was published in 1978. In the intro it states: "cheese blintzes direct from the family kitchen in Brooklyn, where they have been served for forty years without the recipe's ever having been consigned to paper. There are other recipes from the kitchens of farms in Maine.

The second booklet is from The Old Farmers' Almanac and is called Colonial Cookbook. This was published in 1982. It states in several of the recipes that the recipe came from the Wampanoag Indian Tribe and a lot of them came over with the Pilgrims. One of the recipes in this booklet is called "Molasses Pie." When you read it, it is now called Pecan Pie. The only difference is this recipe used molasses and today's Pecan Pie uses Dark Karo Syrup. The directions for cooking Moose are hilarious. But I can't share it with you because it is now copyrighted. And the same for the BHG recipes. What I don't understand is some of these recipes are a couple of hundred years old. And some of them came from a tribe that at the time didn't have a written word.

How about some stuffed calves ears? The ears are from a moose calf. How do you copyright wild veggies such as Jack In The Pulpit, wild carrots, onions, etc.? The recipe tells you to dig these up, but be careful as the wild carrots and The Pulpit have poisonous parts. There are also recipes written in the Olde English with the "f" as an "s". Makes for difficult reading.

I don't understand how recipes that have never been written down and come from the inside of someone's head can be copyrighted.
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