Your Definition of Vegetarian and Pescatarian

[qlopp]

Hi, I'm looking for poll-like responses with discussion regarding how people define the terms vegetarian and pescatarian.

I have searched the internet for definitions and forums for opinions. As I've been cooking for larger groups (free, party style) the thought of inclusivity has me thinking about what I make and how I describe it.

It took until recently for me to realize that a vegetarian diet can be defined as restricting dairy products. Hindsight being superior, I now think of the term vegetarian as being exclusive, i.e. allowing a plant life only diet. But growing up and until recently I'd always thoughtlessly assumed that dairy was vegetarian since it is a product of animals and not the animals themselves.

Modern definitions, including those from respected dictionaries, are typically on the fence regarding dairy, stating some may consider dairy inclusive while others excluded. Hence the confusion.

Definitions for pescatarian seem to vary regarding dairy, only adding seafood to the diet. In some cases the type of seafood may be limited.

How do you define a vegetarian diet? Dairy or no?

How do you define a pescatarian diet? Does it always allow dairy? If so, are all swimming and/or waterborne creatures included or only certain types?

Is there a restaurant/manufacturing industry's or organization's take on this subject that is clear and concise?

 

[taxlady]

When I was a vegetarian, back in the 1970s, I don't think anyone used the term "vegan". There were strict vegetarians, no eggs or dairy. I was an "ovo-lacto" vegetarian. That doesn't include animal flesh, but does allow eggs (ovo) and dairy products (lacto). Most ovo-lacto vegetarians weren't worrying about the fact that cheese is made with rennet, which comes from animals. I guess some did and either avoided cheese or only ate cheeses made with "vegetable rennets". Nowadays, there is a genetically modified bacteria that produces the enzyme that curdles the milk. From the Wikipedia article about rennet:

Most cheese is now made using chymosin derived from bacterial sources.

It's cheaper than rennet from the stomachs of mammals.

I think pescatarian diets come in ovo, lacto, and ovo-lacto versions.

BTW, there are foods that seem like they would be vegetarian, but contain animal products. E.g., Lea & Perrins Worcestershire Sauce has anchovies. There are other brands of Worcestershire sauce that are vegan. It's worth checking. Also, some vegans don't eat honey and some don't eat white sugar, because it is filtered through charcoal made from bones.

 

[dragnlaw]

Just to expand (a tiny bit) not all sugars are filtered thru bone char. Beet sugars are not. Also don't misunderstand, there is no actual bone char in the sugar that is filtered.
In Canada, only the West Coast plants used bone char weheras the eastern ones do not.

 

[taxlady]

Just to expand (a tiny bit) not all sugars are filtered thru bone char. Beet sugars are not. Also don't misunderstand, there is no actual bone char in the sugar that is filtered.
In Canada, only the West Coast plants used bone char weheras the eastern ones do not.

Yeah, I should have written that some white sugar is filtered through bone char. But, a lot of vegans won't eat any white sugar that they don't know specifically was not filtered through bone char. Some require that their sugar be certified for that.

And, while I know that some sugar in North America is from beets, I have never seen any indication on a package of sugar from the grocery store that said whether it was made from sugar cane or from sugar beets. In Denmark, unless it says that it is from sugarcane, it is from beets. The cane sugar is probably more expensive.

 

[Andy M.]

 

[taxlady]

@Andy M. I don't live in the US. I have never seen that brand of sugar. Do the bags of beet sugar label that as well?

 

[Andy M.]

Dominos is one of the larger producers of sugar products in the US. From what I've noticed across different brands, pure cane sugar is labeled as such while packages of beet or other sugars are not.

 

[qlopp]

Dominos is one of the larger producers of sugar products in the US. From what I've noticed across different brands, pure cane sugar is labeled as such while packages of beet or other sugars are not.

C&H is very popular here also; their jingle and packaging promises "pure cane sugar".

 

[qlopp]

When I was a vegetarian, back in the 1970s, I don't think anyone used the term "vegan". There were strict vegetarians, no eggs or dairy. I was an "ovo-lacto" vegetarian. That doesn't include animal flesh, but does allow eggs (ovo) and dairy products (lacto). Most ovo-lacto vegetarians weren't worrying about the fact that cheese is made with rennet, which comes from animals. I guess some did and either avoided cheese or only ate cheeses made with "vegetable rennets". Nowadays, there is a genetically modified bacteria that produces the enzyme that curdles the milk. From the Wikipedia article about rennet:

It's cheaper than rennet from the stomachs of mammals.

I think pescatarian diets come in ovo, lacto, and ovo-lacto versions.

BTW, there are foods that seem like they would be vegetarian, but contain animal products. E.g., Lea & Perrins Worcestershire Sauce has anchovies. There are other brands of Worcestershire sauce that are vegan. It's worth checking. Also, some vegans don't eat honey and some don't eat white sugar, because it is filtered through charcoal made from bones.

Great reply, thank you!

I don't recall the term vegan growing up. It snuck up on me so there's no telling when I first heard it but I'd guess maybe around 2000. I was and am fairly insulated from veganism so that may have played a part in it.

Good point about seemingly vegetarian ingredients like Worcestershire possibly containing animal products.

 

[taxlady]

If you are cooking for a crowd and want to be inclusive, you probably also want to remember that some people don't want to eat gluten. Some people have gluten intolerances. Some have coeliac disease and could become seriously ill from gluten, and some have just heard that "gluten is bad for you".

 

[Aunt Bea]

I wouldn’t overthink it, the world is full of people with dietary restrictions. Most adults have learned to navigate a buffet being mindful of the possible hidden dangers for their specific situation.

Mine happens to be chefs that add large amounts of sugar and high carb sweeteners to things like salad dressings.

If you are confident that some of your offerings are vegan then label them as such.

If you are cooking for a specific individual or group let them define their particular dietary restrictions.

 

[taxlady]

When I bring food to a potluck, I often print out a little label with the ingredients for each dish.

 

[dragnlaw]

I think I've mentioned before... If you've been invited to someone's place that would include a meal - I seriously believe it is up to you to inform your host of dietary restrictions.
It is up to the guest who has accepted the invitation to advise the host - and not upon arrival! but upon accepting the invite.
That being said... if you are just a picky eater and try to dictate to your host what he/she can or cannot put on the menu - then stay home.

 

[tovy]

I like to keep things simple. Pescetarian doesn't eat animals unless they swim. Vegetarian can eat dairy and eggs. Vegans can't.

 

[taxlady]

I like to keep things simple. Pescetarian doesn't eat animals unless they swim. Vegetarian can eat dairy and eggs. Vegans can't.

Are you any of the above? Have you ever been?

 

[GinnyPNW]

If I have a vegetarian coming for a meal, I always ask them to define their diet for me. I don't want to make something they cannot or will not eat and enjoy. Some have told me, "Nothing with a face."

 

[taxlady]

Back in the day, vegans called themselves vegetarians, but often "deeply" or "profoundly" vegetarian. Others, like myself back when I was a vegetarian, called ourselves, ovo-lacto vegatarians or specified that we did eat egg or that we did eat dairy products. Others specified that they only ate food that didn't require the death of animals.

 

[Silversage]

In general, vegans eat no animal or animal by-products. Vegetarians eat no meat, but do eat dairy. Pescatarians eat like vegetarians with the addition of seafood, but no land animals. There are all kinds of variations, but those are the common descriptions.

If you are having guests, it's safest to ask them to define their preferences.

 

[thymeless]

I don't need to define it for anyone. If they want me not to serve them something they need to tell me what they don't want to eat and I'll accommodate them as best I can.

 

[pepperhead212]

Back in the mid to late 70s, when I went away to school, there was a food co-op I joined, to save money, plus, that was when I was getting into cooking. Many people there were vegetarians, of different types, and what we think of as vegans, they had a name for that (before I had ever heard that term) then - "extreme vegetarians".

It wasn't until many years later, when I was learning about Indian cooking, that I found out about Jain Vegetarianism, which is lacto vegetarian, but many things are not allowed - root vegetables, anything fermented, fungi, honey, and a number of other things that kill countless small organisms, while they allow things like grains, and other seeds, since those are a smaller, countable number, of living things. Not sure why, but rhizomes are allowed (despite root vegetables being banned), so ginger, turmeric, and asafoetida are allowed, and the asafoetida is used in many dishes to give an allium flavor to dishes, since those are banned. And in more recent years, more Jains have banned the milk from their diets, due to the treatment of animals in a lot of farming areas.